The BMW dervs, as great as they may be still clatter at idle, particularly the 4-pot. Style is a huge factor in a coupe and finding one with a derv engine is a bit like being introduced to Kate Beckinsdale, only to find she's got an estuary accent. You still would .... but you'd be left with a sense of nagging dissapointment.
The Honda on the other hand does nothing to suggest your Louis Vuitton handbag is filled with rusty spanners; it'll purr like a kitten as you cruise the Boulevard des Chestwigs, lapping up the admiring glances ........ and then howl like a banshee when you open the taps.
Faster isn't necessarily always better and for all its grunt, the BMW makes for a lumpy Creme Brulee .... and that just won't do.
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
The trouble is, something like the Integra Type R promises much, sounds like a race car, needs a zillion revs to get anywhere, screams all the time, but is gutless for the majority of it's powerband. I am not claiming that the derv would be any faster, at least on paper, if as fast even, but it's a better road engine. Faster, more often, if not in theory on paper. The ITR is like being introduced to a supermodel only to find that 364 days a year she smells like last week's chicken leftovers.
The ITR would leave the 123d standing every time under my stewardship, that's for sure, while sounding 50x as good and pulling out ever larger gaps through the bends.
Nooooooooooo, you'd be scratching around, looking for the ONE gear that was suitable for the occasion, whilst the torquesteer-ridden fwd was trying to find some forward momentum! The grunty bi-turbo RWD coupe would clear off, before the ITR had got through the power lag! No worries there!
Originally posted by Bamford: Nooooooooooo, you'd be scratching around, looking for the ONE gear that was suitable for the occasion, whilst the torquesteer-ridden fwd was trying to find some forward momentum! The grunty bi-turbo RWD coupe would clear off, before the ITR had got through the power lag! No worries there!
Waaaaaidaminnit. Your question said nothing about the drivetrain, just the motor. The Boig "stylish coupe" drives the proper wheels.
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
The BMW dervs, as great as they may be still clatter at idle, particularly the 4-pot. Style is a huge factor in a coupe and finding one with a derv engine is a bit like being introduced to Kate Beckinsdale, only to find she's got an estuary accent. You still would .... but you'd be left with a sense of nagging dissapointment.
The Honda on the other hand does nothing to suggest your Louis Vuitton handbag is filled with rusty spanners; it'll purr like a kitten as you cruise the Boulevard des Chestwigs, lapping up the admiring glances ........ and then howl like a banshee when you open the taps.
Faster isn't necessarily always better and for all its grunt, the BMW makes for a lumpy Creme Brulee .... and that just won't do.
haha good post, fair point, D's dont sound very nice, even though they feel nice (Sam Fox).
An alternative comparison is the Fiat 1.4T P v 1.6T D, both 120hp and both with similarish power curves except the 1.4 has a longer rev range. The nerd in me would like to read the stats of those in the same car if I had time!!!
The petrol in this case will no doubt feel powerful without that horrid lull waiting for VVT etc which starts off fun, but (IMO) gets tedious after a year of ownership and as Bamse keeps saying, feels gutless.
I also think VVTs ar to blame for mad power stats blokes aspire too, when really, with proper torque, 120hp is plenty using the gearstick, wheares 120hp via VVT feels underpowered.
There is no torque steer and the power is easily accessible, unless you have learning difficulties. The cars are the same power, but the ITR has better gearing, twice as many revs and is much lighter.
No Oli, it has 'lower' gearing, not 'better' gearing!
I had an S2000, remember, so i know all about low gearing and higher revs, mate.
It's lighter, but very weak at low/medium revs, so during the times that you are not driving 'ten-tenths', (which is the majority of your time on the road, face it), the bi-turbo derv is the better engine.
........on a forum that has developed quite a thirst for the agri-gloop. It's a bit like going to a BNP rally and asking people whether they'd prefer an English or a Polish plumber.
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
Originally posted by Knockside: Very good point there Boig, and one I was about to make myself! Also Ian, I speak from experience and not imagination
I know, but i also speak, from owning just about every type of car and car/motorcycle engine there is, which you know to be true and you have indeed been in many of my faster recent cars.
Originally posted by petrol_blue: I speak from experience as a member of the Honda owners club that they (DC5) are very quick.
I speak from owning many cars with far better real-world shove and owning engines which don't bog down when you put the hammer down in fifth gear. Constantly rowing a gearbox gets tiring.
Originally posted by Bamford: 13-8! Read it and weep!
....read it and realise that opinions are not facts, they are only what people think. Assume for a moment that at 13-8, the 21 contributors represent a balanced and proportionate sample. What you are actually discovering is a general subjective preference for one thing over another, it does not represent conclusive evidence that either is "better".
To achieve that that, you would need to define in detail what it is you want the two things to achieve and objectively measure their performance. Which comes out as better at the job will in no small part depend on the nature of that definition.
Here, the BMW engine can be seen to be generaly preferred for the application you describe but in expressing a preference for the Honda unit those eight of us are not incorrect, its just that our opinion differs from the majority.
So we're not wrong ..... we're just way cooler than the others!!
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
