I've seen a number of posts recently make reference to a cars "soul". I accept that a given manufacturer may be possessed of an illustrious history (Mercedes-Benz, Ferrari), the model even (Lancia Integrale, Porsche 911); or that it's cross-sectional appeal may lend it charm (Citroen 2CV, Renault 4, Austin Mini) but I do not believe any car posesses an intangible quality that make it more than the sum of its parts. What are your thoughts?
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
Obviously it isn't to be taken literaly, but some cars do have a mysterious quality that makes them special.
If someone could work out what it is they'd be very rich.
It can be things like the smell (jump into an old Land Rover, Moggie, Aston or Jag and there is an wonderful smell), the smell of Castrol R, hot brakes and hot exhausts at a control on a rally in the middle of a frosty night gives and old RS1800 'soul'.
Other cars just have a look that makes them special. Old 911's, 250 GTO's, DB4 Zagatos just look like they are alive.
Also some very good cars - technicaly - just have a very sterile feel about them. Again, it's something that is very difficult to put your finger on. I'll not mention any cars, but I think most people will be able to guess what I mean.
Sort of, but the original Audi Quattro has soul, the original LHD M3 does, 2002's do, MkI and II Golf GTi's do, I'm struggling to think of a Japanese car off the top of my head - but there are some (and I don't mean Scoobies and Skylines - great pieces of engineering, but no soul IMO).
I know Palmy will disagree, but my business partner has driven new Mercs for years and they are the most sterile cars I've ever been in. He's got zero interest in cars and buys them because he feels that is what he should have and he percieves tham as reliable (mind his spends more time in the garage than my unreliable Italian car!)
I honestly don't know what the "x-factor" is, but they just don't have it in my eyes.
Interesting it's the two Alfa-males that have picked up on this thread. You Italians, all heart where your heads should be
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
Old Land Rover Old Morris Old Astons & Jags Ford RS1800, a lot of old Fords Old 911's 250 GTO DB4Z BMW MkI M3, 2002, CS VW Golf MkI / II GTi, Beetle M-B SELs Lambo Countach
....theres definitely some nostalgia at work here. What about new cars? Any soulful examples?
_________________________ "Forward", he cried, from the rear, and the front rank died. And the General sat, and the lines on the map moved from side to side.
Originally posted by Noxide: alot of old fords have this quality.
I always feel that the fords didn't have any soul at all, except perhaps the XR2 you mention, all the fords always felt rather sterile, made down to a price, type cars - funnilly enough the old 1300 always seem to have a rather "warm" feeling - but it could have just been the rainwater in the footwells being warmed up by the heater!
soul is an imaginary concept that we see in ourselves and other people. so there is no reason why we cant feel there is a soul in cars. its wrong to say german and japanese cars dont have souls, only that you dont have a feeling for them. if you have owned and driven a german or japanese car for a period of many years it will have a soul just as much as a ferrari etc. ( i have driven a nissan for many years and feel i know it and it knows me). The owner has felt the connection and given it one, its just that noone else will be connected with it or feel it. whereas cars with strong visual/audiable/cultural features not just the owners could say it might have a soul as it doesnt require as much of a personal or physical connection. i think i made sence.
....... There's got to be a hundred reasons why i should listen to diesel owners, but right now, i can't think of any.
Its certainly a personal choice, a lot of you agree that alfas have soul or character, whereas i would disagree, for me the Skyline is car with character and soul, most would disagree, fair enough. Its very much a personal thing. No one can say for sure, this car has soul and this does not, only we ourselves can make that choice.
heres my top 5 'soul cars'
1) Skyline 2) Impreza 3) NSX 4) The Z Series 5) Alfa GT
I think theres a difference between a car's "soul" and someones favourite cars, or in ProfJC's case, Jeremy Clarkson's favourite cars.
In my opinion, a car only has a "soul" if the designers and engineers have put their own "souls" into it. For example, a design of a car would have a soul if the designer didn't simply go with a normal off-the-rack box shape but actually put time and effort into it, aka, his heart and soul. See? It's not just an expression.
It's like a painting, it lets us see the world from the artist's point of view. The same applies with a car.
Soul is an individual concept. Everyone has their own take on which cars do or don't have soul and I believe that's largely based on experience. Certain first cars, cars from people's childhood, often driven in makes etc can all end up with a feeling of "soul" to someone. It depends on your experiences.
Originally posted by pantherd90: Soul is an individual concept. Everyone has their own take on which cars do or don't have soul and I believe that's largely based on experience. Certain first cars, cars from people's childhood, often driven in makes etc can all end up with a feeling of "soul" to someone. It depends on your experiences.
I disagree. As I've said, I think theres a difference between cars having a "soul" and someones favourite cars.
It's difficult to describe but when a car has a soul it has universial appeal. It sings, it flirts, it breaks hearts, it makes dreams come true.
It just seems to have picked up human characteristics from the designers and engineers who worked on it. A car with a soul doesn't need to be (and usually isn't) perfect, in the way that no human is perfect. It just represents someones perspective of the world.
Ah, yes. Weren't people offering a large reward for the car, recently? If I remember, a museum was offering one mei-i-l-l-lion dollars to whoever could recover it. I don't think they were searching for the whole car, just unfound remains. I wonder if they had any luck with that...
But I think they were taking those "warnings" a bit seriously in that story. I think when you see a friend in a very fast sports car you say "ha ha! That's gonna kill ya!"
The James Dean car is really cursed though as all who have bought it have had one form of disaster after the other. I won't go near that car even if i had 1 million bucks.
We are little gods and we imbue soul into the world. What we create is usually always more than the sum of its parts - it is not addition as the mathematical metaphor we need but multiplication. Oxygen and Hydrogen does not lead to an oxygen hydrogen mix but to water which is a wholly different thing with its own intrinsic meanings and capabilities. Not least that it is the prime driver for life on Earth. Water is not simply the sum of its parts.
Soul is imbued both in the design and in the ownership and use. It is a creative act by the creators of the car and the users of the car. Soul in its creation will inspire soul in its use. It is always difficult to define 'soul' in a car but a lot of cars can have soul in design and use. As someone said you can't cynically style it in - Nissan amongst others tried this with the Primera to have a certain dolphin like look.
I run old cars and I accept a lot of things and engineering dynamics of 20 years ago. I accept being rained on, breakdowns (with anger) and looking after the cars. The worst thing I can say about a car is that it has no soul.
Sorry can't think of any. Ha ha ha.
