Can channel 4 explain to me why you would need to be under the age of 30 to enter 4Talent comp? This has outraged me most of the worlds best comedians are over the age of 30 and 40. Don’t get me wrong there are many young great comedians but for people over the age of 30 the door is slammed shut. I myself am doing very well for myself at the moment, but if I was not this would be another dead end. Too much emphases on helping the young, what about supporting all ages or shall all people over the age of 30 go to work at BQ. Not right, and way beyond happy Zeal. Support comedy, support Talent, regardless of age.
To be charitable it might simply be a desperate attempt to find anyone under 30 with a modicum of ability ... no I mustn't say that must I - it's horribly ageist!
I was going to write something funny here, about something which I forget now, for reasons that escape me...damn it I hate it when that happens...ever since I turned 30 I've lost most of my faculties, including my sense of...erm...you know...'thingy'...anyway, I've bored myself now so I'm off to watch the pilot episode of Logan's Run...apparently there's some plot line about something that I thought might be....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Hmm? What? Oh dear...I appear to have 'embarrassed myself' in the trouser area....Nurse! I need more manpons please.
Lol Spanking Gorgeous… I’m very serious about this I would like for Chris or Davina to ask 4 talent why as I would like a reply. Its really not on, your telling me that you could be the best talent at what you do but coz of you’re age your out . As I’ve said I consider this an insult and am not happy at all. I’m not having a pop at Chris or Davina as they are 4laughs but I’d like an address to complain to. So I would like all 4laughers that are affected by the big 30 to come forward and post on this thread please. This cannot happen again and must be stamped out for future competitions so please if this affects you or you do not agree post your support even if you don’t like to post just post “Not happy” in a reply. As I’ve said I’m not effect by this so its not a personal grudge as I’ve been signed to John Lloyds company and now work as a full time comedian and I will not be taking part in future competition plus because of my contract I'll be closing my Zeal account down and opening a new one under my real name as I believe 4lauhgs is about up and coming talent, but if you let this go it will be a tragedy for new talent as according to 4talent talent stops at 30.
I'm happy to be an honorary under 30- they only have to ask. This reminds me - I recently volunteered to write for a local youthy mag for free and they got all excited. After a few emails they asked me to pop into the office just so they could check I wasn't 'some old guy' I asked what they meant by old and they said ' er .. like 40?' It was sooooooooo (you have to put that,see) funny watching them desperately backpedalling on my offer. I think they've actually gone to the wall now as I haven't seen it lately. Can't think why. Shame that.
As a matter of interest, apart from Cosmos how many are there on here under 30?
well if I could edit post I would change that as I dont want this thread to be about that if Chris opps I mean ZaggordLordOfDeath2000 can kindly edit it out. As I do not want this thread hijacked by this issue. Zeal not Terry who's he, I dont know. Not being nasty at all lets keep this thread about the issue.
Sorry was responding to Sabriel just didnt want this thread to become about real names as I feel ageist is just as bad as racist. Sorry Sabriel not being orrible was just warning off future Thread Hijackers.
Yep, ageist AND talentist! I fall within the age limit but can't find anything worthwhile to send them. Bring on the era of non prejudiced ageless and talentless young talent contests!
Well... Another interesting point raised here... It is indeed unfortunate they've got the age cap on it - but it could well be to do with what they want to use the winners for... IE The creation of shows for the youth market, which would need to be written by younger writers, in order to connect appropriately with the audience...
It's the same problem the had with 'Pop Idol' - it being geared solely for younger performers... So they introduced 'X Factor'(for all ages), and now 'Britain's Got Talent'... Otherwise phenomenally gifted singers like Andy Abrams and Paul Potts (who for one reason or another never got the right breaks) would've slipped through the cracks, which would have been a real shame... Other opportunities are out there - many first time novelists, for example, tend to be in their thirties and forties...
Two other points:
Zeal: That's fantastic news about your recent successes... Well done - and I'm sure we'll be seeing you making some major waves in the very near future...
and
Miura: 4Talent are looking for artists, too - so you should absolutely give it a try... Your stuff is exceptional...
Originally posted by Seth Gecko: Well... Another interesting point raised here... It is indeed unfortunate they've got the age cap on it - but it could well be to do with what they want to use the winners for... IE The creation of shows for the youth market, which would need to be written by younger writers, in order to connect appropriately with the audience...
I suggest you tell J K Rowling that she is too old as a writer to connect appropriately with the youth audience!
You make some good points Seth, but not this one. I think it's this kind of thinking that both supports and promotes ageism.
Originally posted by Seth Gecko: it could well be to do with what they want to use the winners for... IE The creation of shows for the youth market, which would need to be written by younger writers, in order to connect appropriately with the audience...
I suggest you tell J K Rowling that she is too old as a writer to connect appropriately with the youth audience!
You make some good points Seth, but not this one. I think it's this kind of thinking that both supports and promotes ageism.
Sorry Seth, but I'm with Frankie on this one...as a writer, it shouldn't matter about your age...Roald Dahl and Enid Blyton spring to mind as purveyors of the finest (closet racist) material for younger markets!
I think the issue 4talent have here is that they want to nurture 'young' talent rather than 'new' talent. If that's the case, then that is what they should say from the get-go and not pussyfoot around using generic 'Talent' terms.
The malaise within tv is that the producers (and this is absolutely a problem at the BBC in terms of comedy) are media graduates with little or no experience of the programming they are working in. How many of them have performed live comedy? How many have worked as script writers? How many have directed comedy before a live audience?
They don't serve apprenticeships under people that have loads of experience, and are constantly fearful of greenlighting a project that is a disaster and thus being replaced, and so will pick up award winning comics or go with the 'usual suspects' and play it safe.
It's a fact that the beeb has producers on the payroll that haven't had a single programme commissioned, despite being 'producers' for years. Producer means gate-keeper now, as they spend more time knocking stuff back. How many times can one person say "It's really good, but it's not quite what we're looking for" but when pressed to say what they are actually looking for they answer "We're not sure"!
Commercial tv and certainly the smaller production companies take more risks and invest in talent more easily, (hence this fabulous site) however, using 4talent criteria, stuff like Spaced, Shaun of the Dead and Hot Fuzz wouldn't have got a look in, never mind funding.
The ageism here though smacks of lazy logic - if it's young, it's must be new and it must therefore appeal to 'yoof' markets...however, there is nothing new under the sun, and if it's funny, it's funny, no matter the age of the audience/writer. It's about presenting something as fresh and new.
So, Zeal, I stand up and say "I"!
I also say "What is the lower end of this age policy?"
Another (horrible) thought that occurs to me considering the demise of Herge, Enid Blyton and Roald Dahl is that maybe in the future J K Rowling's books will be banned because she was 'too old' when she wrote them...
Stupid thought, eh? mmm...
Spare a thought this year, and remember: JUNKMALES aren't just for Christmas...
I am fortunate enough to only be 18, fortunate in many ways, including being able to enter into this competition. Which I am not going to do. I have only just started out in this world of comedy creation and I think 'talent' is something that grows and matures over time. The wealth of experiences and honed style that older writers/performers/artists has is what makes their undiscovered talent the edge at times and I totally disagree with them being excluded from this competition. There, rant over, I am going to return to trying to recover from an alcohol fueled holiday...
Originally posted by Spanking Gorgeous: ...As a writer, it shouldn't matter about your age...Roald Dahl and Enid Blyton spring to mind as purveyors of the finest (closet racist) material for younger markets!
Ahh... That is somewhat of a separate area, though - if you're talking about children's literature... This is comedy for the youth market, which is completely different - for the most part, people want to commission and watch shows from among their own peer group... In the same way teenagers and young adults will all buy the latest bands that are relevant to them, but probably won't necessarily go out of their way to buy the latest album by Shirley Bassey or James Taylor, for example - some do, of course, so it's not a hard and fast rule...
A good contrast, I think is to look at the BBC channels... BBC3 is purely youth orientated, and shows such as 'Ideal' and 'Two Pints Of Lager' reflect this... Whereas BBC4, which runs both 'The Thick Of It' and 'Lead Balloon', which are on a far more intellectual plane, is geared more towards an older market... So within their cellar of talent, there are still plenty of opportunites for writers of any vintage to make the cut...
I completely agree, though, that the age a person was when they wrote the work should be irrelevent... There have been many writers who were just as strong at 18 as others who didn't peak until 40...
Hedge - the magaizne you were going to write for, it wasn't called Itchy or Inside Out was it? Just wondering?
I'm 31 and done a bit of free lance writing. I'm looking to branch into more script writing stuff and have loads of ideas, but can't understand why there's age caps on stuff liek 4Talent.
Anyway, ahd a point but most people have covered it and I'm boring myself. Sorry
Originally posted by Seth Gecko: ...for the most part, people want to commission and watch shows from among their own peer group... In the same way teenagers and young adults will all buy the latest bands that are relevant to them, but probably won't necessarily go out of their way to buy the latest album by Shirley Bassey or James Taylor, for example - some do, of course, so it's not a hard and fast rule...
You seem to be more concerned with performers here, Seth. I thought we were talking about writers?
Sure, youth shows obviously want youth performers, but the writers are behind the scenes... the audience isn't interested in the age of the writers, Seth. In fact, the audience are typically not interested in the writers at all and think the performers make it up as they go along!
If you think the age of a writer is important then fine, but I don't think it does matter.
Ahh... That is somewhat of a separate area, though - if you're talking about children's literature... This is comedy for the youth market, which is completely different - for the most part, people want to commission and watch shows from among their own peer group... In the same way teenagers and young adults will all buy the latest bands that are relevant to them...
Sorry Seth, but what a load of complete and utter tosh!
The Goons, Beyond the Fringe, Python, Fawlty Towers, The Goodies, TWTWTW, Soap, Blackadder, Only Fools & Horses, Porridge, Brass Eye, The Office, Extras...I could go on and on...but the common denominator here is they were all written by people over 30 and yet tapped into either counter culture or youth culture and were/are some of the most often quoted comedy in the schoolyards/offices around the country.
Now I'm not saying that under 30s can't write quality comedy, but to exclude the over 30s is a lazy and rather short-sighted attempt to try and find something 'new' 'fresh' or 'different' based on the perception of producers that if it's 'young it's good for the young' rather than actually working with writers with potential at any age to create new content (hence the literary references above who have absolutely tapped into peer groups, as well as the script writers of the above comedy shows).
You are just as guilty of lazy logic if you think that 'comedy for the youth market' is created any differently to 'COMEDY' in general.
By saying that "people (whoever THEY are!) want to commission and watch shows from among their own peer group" you are talking about perceptions rather than actuality, which I hope the list above proves to be a mistake.
Once again, sorry if my tone offends, but if we as writers don't say something rather than excusing it, there will be absolutely no longevity for writing careers
