A small party of us recently ate at a restaurant where the quality of food and the service was average. At the end of the evening we noted that an 'optional 10% service charge' had been added to the bill - about £16. We decided not to pay this as we felt that the quality of the food and service did not justify it. We decided instead to leave a (smaller) tip for the staff. But we were stopped on our way out and told we had "underpaid". We pointed out the 'optional' part of the service charge but it took some assertion on our part to point out that we were not obliged to pay. Obviously, we won't be eating there again.

I am used to the practice of automatically adding 10% to the bill in the US but it seems to be creeping in here. I have always left a tip for good or exceptional service but I'm a bit put out by what seems to be 'expected' these days. It also makes me wonder where the service charge goes - is it indeed for the staff or do the owners absorb it into their profits, and if so, are we expected to leave yet another tip for the staff?

I also find it hard to accept that staff should 'always' be tipped on the grounds they are on a low wage. This just gets employers off the hook. It should be them paying the wages, not us. There are many low paid jobs that do not get tax free 'extras' on a daily basis. Having said that, I'm happy to leave a tip where it is deserved.

It's easy to get confused. Should be paying a fair price for a meal out, which includes the costs of the service in the price of a meal? If we want to leave a gratuity then surely that should be optional and the amount left to our discretion? I'm certain we shouldn't be bullied or misled into paying 'optional' charges.
I'd be interested in other views.

I've noticed in a few eating places that they automatically add on a service charge, which I think is unacceptable, you should only tip of the food and service is worth it. If the food and service ss good then I will tip in excess of the normal 10/15%. However, if I have an expensive bottle of wine or Champagne (DP, Krug or Cristal) then I will not 'tip' on the cost of the wine/Champange as they make enough on the mark-up.

I think the reason for tipping has been lost in today's take, take, take attidude and the real reason behind the tip has been lost.

Oh before I may get abused for my tipping methods, I am a fully qualified chef and worked many years front of house & know how much (or sometimes little) work is involved.

Merry Christmas eash & all

I don't tip at all. They are paid to do a job and paid to do it properly, if they don't like the wage then don't work there.

I will always pay the 10% but I did ask once for it to be taken off. They were lucky I paid for the meal to be honest. I had to wait 10 mins for them to bring rice when they had already given us everything else. I had to get up and ask 3 people and by the time it turned up the sauce was cold and couldnt really eat it. Plus i was so mad I wasnt hungry! They took it off no problem. I would have refused to pay but for the fact i have been there many times before and it had always been wonderful previously.
I always tip but had nevr thought of the wine thing before which is a good point.

I totally agree that leaving a tip should be out of choice and not expected. I have worked as a waitress and receptionist for 6 years and would like to point out to 'Madge' that tips are not suppossed to be 'tax free'. Cash tips are tax free as the tax man does not have to see them but credit card tips do have tax taken off them around 35-40%.

Waiters are sadly evading taxes by not declaring cash tips. They should be declared to the tax office and taxed accordingly.

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However, if I have an expensive bottle of wine or Champagne (DP, Krug or Cristal) then I will not 'tip' on the cost of the wine/Champange as they make enough on the mark-up.

Actually this is incorrect. Most places (except exclusive bars) only have a nominal profit on high cost items like vintage Champagne and Wines. Larger profits are made on house wines. And how does the waiter make anything on the markup?

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Originally posted by BexTech:
I don't tip at all. They are paid to do a job and paid to do it properly, if they don't like the wage then don't work there.

This attitude is making sure people serving you are less and less skilled. By your reckoning, only the absolutely desperate would take service jobs and your meal experience would not be to your liking. Yes, waiters are paid to do a job - serve you food. It doesn't mean they have to do the lots of extras customers demand, usually without any kind of respect or courtesy offered to those doing the serving. A tip is an incentive to give excellent service.
I hope you are selective about where you eat, as Tyler Durden once said "Don't mess with thosr that serve you food"

I used to be totally against tipping as I saw it as an excuse for employers to pay waiters etc poorly.

I changed my mind a couple of years ago when as an accountant, one of my clients was investigated by the revenue for tax evasion. The client was a cab driver, in fact the only cabbie i know who lists his tips seperately, and the revenue looked at his books & said that the tips weren't high enough. He on average received 3% tips, but the revenue expected that it should be 10-15%! He eventually had to pay taxes on earnings he never recieved!

The revenue are coming down hard on all industries where tipping occurs, which i think is a real shame. It means we feel guilt ridden into tipping as employees will be taxed for it anyway, whether they've earned it or not.

I am now a regular tipper, in restaurants & cabbies in particular, but it doesn't mean I don't resent it a little.

i only tip if i think the service has been exceptional - i hate this culture of being 'expected' to tip & getting services charges added to the bill - i also dont understand who decided who should get tips - namely waiters, hairdressers & cabbies.... if its poorly paid services what about people who work in corner shops?!?!
and i also think people should be charged tax on their tips - if its seen as an income supplement & a reason to work for lower official pay, then why not?

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i also dont understand who decided who should get tips - namely waiters, hairdressers & cabbies.... if its poorly paid services what about people who work in corner shops?!?!

Waiters are bringing you food, hairdressers cut your hair, cabbies get you where you want to go. Pretty simple, you want them to do it faster/better/ so you TIP (To Improve Performance) - would you be miffed if your newsagent spent an extra minute to serve you because you didn't tip?
The service staff you mentioned are essentially luxuries and if you want to be treated like a king, you need to give an incentive.

lots of pros and cons on tipping. Personally I hate it. Its not the actuall parting with the money that I despise but I think its demeaning. Somebody has to depend on handouts is embarrasing for them and also for the person to whom they have served. How much should they give. Will they be offended if it is too little. I work in a customer service role but not in one where tipping is considered necessary thank goodness. A 'thankyou for your trouble' makes my day.