What did you think of The Final Insult (Monday 11 April at 8pm)?

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Originally posted by julia bard:
What did you think of The Final Insult (Monday 11 April at 8pm)?

I was unable to watch it, but judging by the trailers, C4 should be thanked for bringing such a disgraceful treatment of the Holocaust victims to the general publics attention.

I am absolutely mortified and horrified at your investigation, and congratulate you on an excellent piece of journalism I am so incensed that i am moved to write to the claims conference and shame them.
I am not jewish however my father was a liberator and one of the first to enter the concentration camps, as a quartermaster sergeant it was his responsibility to clothe and feed survivors in the immediate aftermath, he saw people dieing from eating, he always maintained that seeing film or photographs of the survivors brought back the smell, i didnt find out about his experiences until after his death as he didnt wish his children to have nightmares , he never spoke of his wartime experiences.
i do so hope that your film will bring an investigation and redress to survivors who are struggling, i am sure something will be done as a result of your film , these people ( claims conference executives )are criminals who should be tried for crimes against humanity at The Hague , they should not be allowed to get away with this .

I have just written to each of the offices of the claims conference here is a copy of my letter ;
Sirs
I have just viewed the Channel 4 documentary The Final Insult, your executive board should be tried for crimes against humanity and forced to make immediate interim payments to survivors shown in this documentary, to alleviate their suffering,
You should be truly ashamed of yourselves.
If justice is not apparent in this world , I certainly hope you pay for your crimes in the next .
Shame on you .
I am not jewish but my father was a liberator of a camp in 1945 , as a quartermaster sergeant his responsbility was to clothe and feed survivors in the immediate aftermath , he watched as people died as they ate , he never spoke of his wartime experiences as he didnt wish his children to have nightmares, I discovered his involvement after his death , God rest his soul, do your duty and help these poor people who are struggling to survive in their old age and stop prevaricating ,
The World is now watching you .
In anticipation of immediate action,
David Frederick Wainwright
Plymouth
Devon
the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

Lett328, I struggle to understand the comparison you're making with your parents' experience coming to the UK - were they in a Nazi death camp?

Dear Julia,
Thank you, thank you , thank you for publicizing this horrible insult to the Holocaust Survivors. As a child of two holocaust survivors and someone who has worked professionally with Holocaust Survivors, I can say that Survivors are very unpleased with the Claims Conference. It is a scam! They will claim to offer aide and support, but , the reality is that many survivors struggle to pay for medical expenses, medication, and daily living. For instance, my mother (God Bless her name) died in Israel several years ago. She was a Survivor. She received absolutely no support from charities that received claims conference money. My father, also a surivor, who lives in the States (in a retirement home for homeless) would like help with medication, health, an annual trip to see his grandchildren, and even burial expenses (when this comes a reality). Instead, he has to fill out coutless forms, over and over again, in order to receive some compassionate help from the claims conference, who hold his money. The best victory for survivors is always the success of their children, and not an expensive commemoration ceremony. Why can't children and grandchildren of survivor receive grants for education?
These are the realities of the greedy nature of the claims conference, who think they have the right to decide what Holocaust Survivors want.
shame, shame.

Dear Julia,

I found this programme very questionable. The sinister music and the comparisons of the Claims Conference to the "worst bank raid in history" made me feel extremely uncomfortable.

Many many Jews in Eastern Europe were not wealthy however there were also many, especially in Germany, Hungary and Czechoslovakia who were well off and did have businesses, property and money before the war and as we know, only a small number of Jews survived the Holocaust.

My great grandparents were living in Warsaw and were never heard of again after the Nazis invaded Poland. Even after all these years we have not been able to trace what happened to them. They were either murdered by the Nazis in Warsaw or they died in the Warsaw Ghetto of starvation or disease or they were taken to Treblinka death camp and murdered, we just dont know. Like many, they disappeared without a trace.

I feel as a Jewish mother of teenagers, that the money that has been given towards "Birth Right Israel" " The Israel Experience" and the many memorials to the Holocaust, wherever they are situated (even in the West Bank) is just and right. Both my children have been to Yad Vashem in Jerusalem and the Holocaust Memorial Museum in New York and both are fully aware of what happened the the Jewish people during that time.

I feel that as long as the remaining survivors are given enough money for them to live the rest of their lives in comfort, then it is totally correct that the remainder of that money (ORIGINALLY BELONGING TO JEWISH PEOPLE BEFORE IT WAS STOLEN BY THE NAZIS goes to our Jewish children, teenagers and to Israel for building a long and secure future for the Jewish people.

I am positive that the people who died in the Holocaust would want that.

Nicole

The programme failed to point out some facts, which give a very different picture.
So far as concerns the undistributed Swiss Bank moneys, these are not held or controlled, let alone available to ,the Claims Conference-and incidentally have been used to augment German Government and Industry moneys paid to slave labourers and their heirs .

In the second place the numbers of survivors and slave labourers have been the subject of detailed academic research, none of which was mentioned-rather unsubstantiated opinions of two individuals were held out as facts

Finally the underlying assumption that moneys recovered by the claims conference from heirless Jewish property in Germany were to be used solely for survivors , and the extent to which such moneys are used for education/historical research [the ratio is 80:20]is a subject which has been discuused passionately within the Claims Conference, and those debates are in the public domain. None of those discussions was mentioned.

Congratulations to the makers of this program and to the C4. The criticism of Jews, in any shape or form, brings all the usual; Holocaust denier, Jew hater , etc, etc. In case of Filkenstein ,not to mention genuine holocaust victims -self hater!?
I hope people in USA will have the chance to see this pogram (ha!)
Permanent "victim - I can do no wrong" status should end.
By the way half of my family was killed - you know the usual; wall here and there, few prisons and concetration camps.Forgot to mention they lost everything during the war.
Once again
Thank You

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Originally posted by arkangel:
Lett328, I struggle to understand the comparison you're making with your parents' experience coming to the UK - were they in a Nazi death camp?

The comparison shows that just because someone has been through a terrible experience it does not mean that they are unable to get on with their lives. I also draw attention to the Russians who were responsible for many more deaths than six million even before Stalin came to power and in all have been responsible for many more deaths than the Nazis. The difference is that the Soviets were able to hide their atrocities in the vastness of Russia, have had more time and did not pick on any particular section of society, especially one that could apply financial pressure to extract settlements to recompense for misdeeds. The Soviets did pick on jews, not specifically because they were jews but because they represented a perceived threat as a coherent group.

Because someone was a survivor of the camps does not mean that they would automatically live in poverty and therefore require financial aid as suggested in the programme. The financial problems of the participants in the programme seem to me to be an indictment of the American welfare system rather than the result of their experiences in the camps. Don’t get me wrong I have no problem with poor people being helped but generating funds through dubious claims ostensibly to help a section of society and then not using the funds for that purpose I would regard as dishonest. My feeling was that the programme failed to really challenge the Claims Conference and the other jewish organisations to justify their practices and motives and went for the sympathy option with the result that Israel Singer was able to easily brush off the criticisms of a few disgruntled contributors.

It should be remembered that the estimated six million jewish dead comprised only 10% of the deaths due to war yet for understandable reasons only the jews are regarded as victims. The Holocaust Industry and Israeli governments have used this victim status to deflect criticism of their actions. The earlier Channel 4 programme covered this aspect in more detail.

First of all I would like to state that I am neither Jewish or of an age to remember the Second World War. However, I am of an age when I have grown up living with and listening to people who did live during this terrible time and some of the stories I have heard are not pleasant.

If and I, for one, believe the majority of what was stated in The Final Insult is true then The Jewish Claims Conference as an organisation are treating the survivors of one of the worlds most horrible and depraved acts of genocide with the utmost contempt and disregard. When the Jewish Claims Conference and the American law firms that 'jumped' onto the bandwagon decided to 'liberate' the funds of Jewish holocaust victims the Jewish Claims Conference stated that this was for them, THE HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS. However it appears that large sums of money that should have been spent ensuring that survivors of this great tragedy were given comfort and succour in their last few years has been spent on giving Jewish birthright people tours of Israel/Jerusalem, giving Isreali soldiers history lessons on the Holocaust (they should have learnt that at school!!!) et al. This just goes to show that money can blind everyone, even those who pertain to be religious (Rabbi's) and are part of the Jewish Claims Conference. Are these the self same people who wanted Jesus dead because he threw the money-lenders out of the temple? I WONDER??

Ask the question ‘how much money are the people heading up this organisation getting paid per annum’. Then remember how much the average holocaust survivor is getting, it’s about $3000 per annum. I am sure that the people in charge of the Jewish Claims Conference and its subsidiaries, if it has any, are NOT living on such paltry sums of money.

PAY THEM NOW SO THAT THEY CAN LIVE AND DIE IN PEACE AND WITH PEACE OF MIND

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Originally posted by Lett328:

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Originally posted by arkangel:
Lett328, I struggle to understand the comparison you're making with your parents' experience coming to the UK - were they in a Nazi death camp?

The comparison shows that just because someone has been through a terrible experience it does not mean that they are unable to get on with their lives.
...
It should be remembered that the estimated six million jewish dead comprised only 10% of the deaths due to war yet for understandable reasons only the jews are regarded as victims.

Right, so they weren't in a Nazi death camp. Which probably explains your use of the rather understated, anaemic phrase "a terrible experience" with regard to surviving (or not) a Nazi extermination camp.

And talking of Nazi extermination camps I suspect gypsies, homosexuals, the families of Nazi Germany's physically and mentally impaired, of Russia's POWs and of Poland's political prisoners may disagree with your assertion that "only the jews are regarded as victims". That may be true of the partially informed, but the 5 or 6 million viewers per episode of BBC 2's recent 'Auschwitz: The Nazis and the Final Solution' series know better.

Here's an interesting piece from today's news which highlights the innocence and integrity of the Swiss banks and why we should all feel so sorry for them in the wake of 'the world's biggest bank job'

BBC News item from today

Dear Julia,

First of all, I must congratulate you for an excellent documentary and for bringing attention to egregious crimes against the unfortunate people first by Hitler and now by the Claims Conference and the World Jewish Congress. Every person of conscience owes you a great debt of gratitude for highlighting their plight.

There are a few questions, however, that I think should also have been raised, but were not touched in the documentary. Most importantly, the question of the Holocaust as an ideological tool in the defence of Israel. For instance, as demonstrated with extensive documentation by Prof. Finkelstein in The Holocause Industry, the holocaust was only rediscovered after the 1967 war, when it became ideologically serviceable. This context may have helped explain the cynicism of the Claims Conference and the WJC, particularly in how the funds were squandered on cultural enterprises in Israel, while the survivors have to struggle even for the meagre stipend.

I am hoping that Channel 4 will have re-runs of this documentary so that more people witness this outrage and are inspired into action like some of the earlier posters.

Arkangel wrote:

And talking of Nazi extermination camps I suspect gypsies, homosexuals, the families of Nazi Germany's physically and mentally impaired, of Russia's POWs and of Poland's political prisoners may disagree with your assertion that "only the jews are regarded as victims". That may be true of the partially informed, but the 5 or 6 million viewers per episode of BBC 2's recent 'Auschwitz: The Nazis and the Final Solution' series know better.[/QUOTE]

The Holocaust industry is dedicated to reminding everyone of the suffering of the jews, which is fine. However, the Holocaust industry is so successful that it obscures any other group's suffering. Anyone who would draw attention to non-jewish suffering is considered to be diminishing the jewish genocide and anti semitic. If there are any museums and memorials dedicated to gypsies, Russian POWs and german disabled exterminated by the Nazis please let us know. The Holocaust industry relies on this supremecy to maintain its political and economic power. How else could it have pressured the Swiss banks into a settlement which exceed what was due by a factor of five? In comparison to the Holocaust industry BBC2 viewers carry very little weight. There is nothing wrong in preserving the memory of the dead like the Royal British Legion but using the dead for politcal purposes is wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by arkangel:
Here's an interesting piece from today's news which highlights the innocence and integrity of the Swiss banks and why we should all feel so sorry for them in the wake of 'the world's biggest bank job'

BBC News item from today

Britain’s hands are not exactly clean when it comes to conduct in WW2. The Bank for International Settlements established in 1930 included as shareholders and financiers the Bank of England, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, the Reichsbank, the Bank of Italy, the Bank of France and other central banks. Before WW2 the BIS financed Hitler’s rearmament and during the war continued to take deposits, launder Nazi loot, make loans to German companies and thus make profits from the Nazi regime. Throughout WW2 UK bank officials continued to meet with representatives of the other shareholders, including top Nazi finance officials, in Switzerland and Britain received dividends from its investment in the BIS. The criticism of Swiss Banks for their conduct in WW2 may be well deserved but this singling out should not be allowed to act as a smokescreen to hide others who participated.

One of the few genuinely thought provoking instances of investigative journalism. Channel 4 must be congratulated.
The Holocaust was the supreme illustration of ‘man’s humanity to man’, unfortunately it is far from the only one!
Spielberg’s project amongst others will ensure accurate information for future historians but I anticipate a time when the Holocaust will be viewed with apathy, ignorance and complete non-understanding.
What surprises me are the present attitudes of those who hold the purse strings.
Are they Jews?
If not then they are in no position to question any claim made by a ‘survivor’, and if they are Jew’s then they are contributing to their own downfall. Shakespeare, Dickens and the Nazi propaganda machine focussed on the popular belief that Jews were only concerned with ‘picking a pocket or two’. The Final Insult may very well have proved how perceptive the three ‘authors’ were!
The programme certainly agitated a few Hornets but I was disappointed at its conclusion. There was an opportunity to provide a possible explanation to the ultimate Holocaust question.
Why did God allow this to happen?
The bible contains numerous accounts of Gods testing of humanity, with a promise of implacable wrath should we fail. There is no great mystery why the actual Holocaust took place. It occurred because humanity was capable of it!! What God may have wanted to observe was the manner in which it’s aftermath was conducted. Judging by the ‘Final Insult’ the ‘end of term’ report reads, ‘Didn’t try at all’.
It’s not about huge sums of money, beachfront property or fine restaurants where the waiters maybe civilised but the portions are equally unfulfilling! The only concern should be the welfare of people whose nightmares we can only guess at, whose suffering we cannot imagine and whose solitude is exasperated by those who make a very nice living ‘championing the cause’!
If everything were running smoothly and above board there would not have been a television programme. What amazes me is the refusal to acknowledge hardship in whatever forms it takes. By all means spend money on educational programmes, take Jews to the camps and sponsor whatever you want to, but do not overlook the people who suffered the holocaust. To do so shows a complete lack of empathy, respect and not a shred of compassion. What has God got in store for you?

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Originally posted by Lett328:
If there are any museums and memorials dedicated to gypsies, Russian POWs and german disabled exterminated by the Nazis please let us know.

Oh, do you mean like this one dedicated to the gypsies murdered by the Nazis at Mauthausen? Gypsy Memorial

or this one dedicated to French miners murdered by the Nazis at Sachsenhausen? French memorial

or this one dedicated to Jehovah's Witnesses murdered by the Nazis in the concentration camps? Jehovah's Witnesses memorial

or this one dedicated to Czech students murdered by the Nazis in the concentration camps? Czech memorial

or - shall we bring it closer to home? - this one dedicated to British soldiers murdered by the Nazis in Sachsenhausen concentration camp? British memorial

You neglected to add that those Memorial pictures are "Actual Size".

Poor old Swiss banks. We should feel really sorry for them.

BBC News:
Swiss bank exploited Nazi slaves

"One of the world's biggest banks, UBS of Switzerland, has admitted for the first time that it exploited Nazi slave labourers during World War II.

It is the first time the bank, which prevented Holocaust survivors and their families from retrieving their wartime assets, has admitted exploiting slave labour."

The Real Insult