My wife and I have had an offer accepted 10 percent below asking price. The house has not been kept up and needs a lot of interior and some exterior work which is possibly the reason for it going slightly cheaper. We were prepared to go through the hassle of getting all the work done to our taste

Incidentally the home buyers survey picked up that the house had been underpinned which has been subsequetly confrimed by the seller.
They have provided some paper work which is just the warranty of the underpinning till 2010 (incidentally the house was underpinned in 1990) They do not have any other paper work as regargds the details of the exent of work carried out and the damege that was caused.

I tried to contact the company who carried out the underpiining job and the one which supervised it (The structural engineers) both of which are still in business but they also havent been able to furnish any detailed paperwork.

Incidentally the company who is currently insuring the property is Saga and they would not insure me or my wife as we are below fifty.

We had a structural survey carried out by a structural engineer and a homebuyers survey by a chartered surveyor both of whom have told us that in their opinion there is no ongoing subsidence.

Also the area where we are intending to buy is South east London where there is high risk of subsidence and approx 25 percent properties are underpinned (So we are told)

Now our questions are

Should we just walk away considering it has been underpinned and the paperwork is incomplete?

Or if we do get an insurance through a specialist broker (Bureau insurance) then we should consider buying it?

Ou fears are that will we be looking at a lot of hassle when we come around to selling the property in the future?

And what is the possibility that the house which has been underpinned is likely to do so again ?

Any help and advice shall be appreciated. Thanking you in anticipation

Well you have pretty much answered your own question. The underpinning is by a geniune company qho are still in existance, rather than a fly-by-night company that threw something in and ran.

You have the word of your surveyor that the underpinning looks sound.

Indemnity Insurance does not cost much, and is often a one off payment. I think that it is reasonable and as likely to be fine as any property purchase if you choose to go ahead with buying this property that you like so much.

Ary.

I'm surprised that the vendor has no other paperwork from the company that did the underpinning, other than the warranty (although that is a very important document to have). The other paperwork should tell you the extent of the underpinning that was carried out ie was the house completely underpinned or was it partially underpinned. However, if you have a surveyor and a structural engineer stating that they feel that there is no further problems I feel this is enough to proceed with.

With regards to the insurance issue, apparently it is quite easy to obtain through the Halifax.

Thanks for the advice much appreciated. I shall try and get whatever paperwork possible and then proceed

Think about how hard it might be to sell on though.

If you can get the paperwork, and 25% of properties in the area have been underpinned, I don't see why it should be too difficult to sell.

If you can not get the paperwork, get the structural engineers to give you a letter of structural adequacy stating that the property is currently free from movement.

I remember seeing a program a few years ago about underpinning, and a contractor who specialised in this work stated that he had never underpinned a building that had actually needed it, it was just that the insurance companies insist on it!

The RICS believe the figures are a little higher, but also say:

'It is estimated that only 20-30% of properties suffering from subsidence need underpinning and the Institution of Structural Engineers recommends it's only (sic) be used as a last resort.'

http://www.rics.org/NR/exeres/7CA2C8CB-D8D2-497E-9C5D-F3A18B1A9B73.htm

Having said that, once it has been carried out the property should be structurally sound and saleable.

Id check on exactly how much the insurance is going to be . I came across this problem in North London earlier this year and found the premiums were very significantly higher,(specialist companies have you by the short and curlies)-- they were apparently likely to rise significantly when the guarantee ran out too, and I found it was even restrictive to get contents insurance if the property had ever had ubsidence - lots of the better value companies like Direct Line, wont touch you. Wont look good on the HIP packs either. However if its an appealing one off type property, oppose to a bog standard run of the mill one, you will probably have no trouble selling on .Sounds like your 10% off was only because of work required rather than reflecting any possible selling hassle.

Thanks for the info
I have asked the vendors?estate agents to get hold of the paperwork and then get me quotes for insurance . I have also made them aware if the quotes are too high then we may have to negotiate further on the price.
I will push it scince I am not in a chain and my mortgage is all sorted. If they thing its a difficult sell the I am hoping to negotiate a bit further.
Just out of interest what is a good negotiation price off the asking price for a house in other peoples opinion.

We are in a similar situation, as we are looking to buy an underpinned house in South East London, but the guarantee has expired. Our buildings survey states that there is no ongoing problem, and the house looks stable.

Did you decide to proceed with the house, and did you experience any problems getting builings cover?

We are trying to get a discount from the vendor, so any info on costings is much appreciated.

Thank you :-)

The seller really should produce the original structural engineer's report and specification of works plus his certificate of satisfactory completion together with the Building Regulation completion certificate. Most insurers will want to see these. If the seller has lost them that is his look out.

As a conveyancing solicitor I believe the information given in the post to be useful but I accept no liability except to fee-paying clients

I bought my house in January and it was underpinned in the early 90s. My vendor's solicitor had lost the paperwork at the time she bought it so all I could do was get hold of copy papers from neighbours relating to the houses either side that had been affected by the same problem (tree roots from some giant horse chestnut trees). I did establish that the company that carried out the work had gone out of business so any guarantee they provided would be worthless anyway. The house is in a very desirable location so the 'previously underpinned' status will not impact upon resale and I had no problem whatsoever getting insurance via Halifax Insurance with the standard £1,000 subsidence excess. The only thing they wouldn't cover was the rear extension other than if it subsided in conjuction with the main house.

Hi All,

Bit of help needed as we're not quite sure what to do...continue with the house or pull out - as to how bad it all sounds??!! (We're FTB)

We've had the valuation completed by the mortgage company which reads:

Deflection was evident to brickwork above bathroom window opening and lintel support may not be adequate - install adequate support as necessary.
Essential Repairs:
1. The property has been affected by structural movement and whilst this is considered to be longstanding and non progressive, this cannot be confirmed - obtain further advice from a structural engineer and carry out remedial works as necessary.
2. Lead pipework should be replaced as necessary.

We have had the structural engineer go in have a look and are awaiting his actual report, however I have spoken to him and he seems to think that there will be no problems. The seller has confirmed that when they bought the house they also had structural movement on their survery but encountered no other problems....


Thanks in advance

Does this sound like something we should be really concerned about?

The leadpipework should be replaced asap.
Not good for your health and the pipes are probably really manky on the interior walls.

Structure questions....not too sure....you don't actually say whether underpinning has been carried out at any time.

You have have done the right thing though by having a structural engineer have a look and report on what he finds so I guess you have to be guided by his comments in his findings report.

Replacing a bathroom lintel is no big deal so I wouldn't be too concerned about that.
Mel.

Yes underpinning has been carried out in the past but not by the people we are buying from, been done previously, we are waiting on the certificate to find out exactly when it was done & also if its still under warranty.

Meant to ask, any ideas on cost of replacing lead piping?

Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by the_waterboi:
Meant to ask, any ideas on cost of replacing lead piping?

Thanks

You can only go on quotations from qualified plumbers to replace lead piping with copper/plastic pipework.
Mel.

Sounds like Grove Park to me!! If I am right I have a fair idea where your buying, and indeed a lot of houses in that area have been underpinned.

And NO not all houses in Grove Park suffer from this problem, just a couple of roads that I know of

You mention the previous insure would not budge I can tell you how to solve this problem

PS
Underpinned houses should sell for upto 5% below the market price WHY ??!!!