My mate Gary bought a small house ten months ago and discovered only after completion that the neighbour next door creates a noise problem. He is a bit deaf and has his TV on loud, he also plays loud classical music regularly. Neither of us noticed this when viewing the property, probably because it's often masked by the sound of the boiler. Gary now wants to sell up, not actually because of the noise which he found that he could ignore after a while, but because he plans to move in with his girlfriend. He's only met the neighbour once, the man seemed very nice and told Gary then to let him know if the TV was too loud at all. We thought perhaps that he'd had complaints before, which is why he mentioned it. Gary didn't raise the problem then though because it was just after he'd bought the house and he didn't yet realise that the man's TV is on all day and most of the evening!

Since getting the house I know that Gary has mentioned the noise problem to some of the other people on the street in general chat but he's never actually made any complaints to his neighbour about the noise. He says this is because he could ignore it and he's out a lot travelling for work and he didn't want any hassle. What his chances are of selling the house I can't say, but I know he doesn't plan to mention the noise to anyone viewing in the hope that they don't notice it. I'm concerned though because I don't know what the legal position is on this. Of course any neighbour disputes would have to be declared. However, Gary is now completing the seller's information form to send to the solicitor and isn't sure what to write on that. Am I correct in thinking that he doesn't have to declare anything about the noise problem because he hasn't made any complaint about it directly to his neighbour? Any advice welcomed, thanks.

You are right. Gary does not have to declare anything as no dispute has occured.

When getting viewings, Gary could have a word with the neighbour and mention that he is selling, maybe the neighbour out of good will, will be quiet? This in itself is not a dispute either.

Other than that, play a bit of quiet, subtle music , this may distract any neighbouring noise

If there hasn't been a dispute, which there hasn't, then he has nothing to write on the form. I'm not sure how he stands when potential buyers actually ask the question though. I know it's a question I asked when I bought my house, and it is a very important issue. He has to just hope that potential buyers are not very probing in their questions.

For instance, if they ask 'what are the neighbours like', his response might only be 'very nice, I don't have a lot to do with them because I'm out a lot but we say hello and pass the time of day occasionally'. If they ask specific questions he would be advised not to lie.

Depends on who's viewing really. Some FTBs don't ask the right questions.

It's not a dispute (which it isn't, from what you have said), and so as long as he doesn't lie if asked the question he doesn't need to declare it. If the neighbour has the TV on all the time he may get asked about the noise at veiwings; I think he has to answer honestly but no need to bring the subject up unless the viewers do.

Let the buyer beware. It's up to them to ask the right questions.

quote:

Originally posted by queenstomper:
If there hasn't been a dispute, which there hasn't, then he has nothing to write on the form. I'm not sure how he stands when potential buyers actually ask the question though. I know it's a question I asked when I bought my house, and it is a very important issue. He has to just hope that potential buyers are not very probing in their questions.

For instance, if they ask 'what are the neighbours like', his response might only be 'very nice, I don't have a lot to do with them because I'm out a lot but we say hello and pass the time of day occasionally'. If they ask specific questions he would be advised not to lie.

Depends on who's viewing really. Some FTBs don't ask the right questions.

Maybe he should get the agent to show people around, then he can't be asked the question directly

If the neighbour was to switch his hearing aids on there would be no need to have the volume turned up on the Telly.
My Mother-in-Law (bless her!) is as deaf as a post without her "ears" switched on but once on She can hear a pin drop from 50 yards away.
She certainly doesn't have her Telly on at high volume---just normal.

Thanks to all of you for your thoughts on this, I feel better now. I was just concerned that Gary might end up making a potentially expensive mistake. I've sent him a link to this thread because I think he needs to take onboard your advice. Hopefully he will hand all viewings over to the EA, it would make sense anyway with him being away quite a bit on business.

quote:

Originally posted by MELBOY:
My Mother-in-Law (bless her!) is as deaf as a post without her "ears" switched on but once on

Or is she? Could just be pretending so you let slip some juicy remark.

Reminds me of being at school where our physics teacher was deaf as a post. Went in to see him one afternoon, and as traditional, stood at his office door and shouted his name really loudly. He came out and said "There's no need to shout. I've got my new batteries in. Got fed up of my collegues complaining about you lot coming here and shouting for me."

My property is also on the market and we have hadto ask ourt neighbour to turn the music down but he dosnt, well to be fair, he thinks he does, but its not enough. If we lose a buyer due to his music do we have a leg to stand on in court if it should get that far? He is council and we own our property, the council are not interested. I have not made a formal complaint but we have asked for the diary sheets but not received yet.So at this point we dont haev to declare a dispute. I dont know if its best to get the whole thing dealt with by a solicitor. If this stops the problem we should be able to sell if not can we take the housing association to court for duty of care and irresponsible placement? Any advice would be great!

You say the council are not interested, but you then say you have asked for diary sheets. I think they would want you to fill these in before they do anything, and you may then find them more helpful. But why have you asked for these when you are already on the market? It will be evidence of a dispute, which you will have to declare.

But formal disputes aside, the buyers information pack now includes the question "have you ever complained to a neighbour about something they have, or have not, done?" So you will have to declare the music scenario at that point.

i spoke to them in an informal manor, they suggested i take the diary sheets and keep a record. At this point, on legal advice, there is no dispute. As soon as i return the forms then the predure starts and then i would have to declare. The problem at this time is that while i am on the market i also cant live at my property, during the week i have to live with earplugs constantly and at weekends i have to stay at my parents. I am nervous that if we get an offer we will lose it due to the noise, so isnt it better to start the procedings and get the issue resolved as soon as possible?

i just want a quiet life again!!

That was what I meant - if you return the diary sheets then a 'dispute' will be in process.

I guess you have to decide if the flat is saleable at the moment - presumably not as any buyer will hear the music and run a mile. If that is the case you have no choice but to start a formal process to try to get it resolved. It would be preferable to have it resolved before you go on the market though - I would have thought it would be impossible to sell while a dispute is ongoing, as a buyer will want to know there is a positive outcome.

Hi all,

By laws makes it that all reasons for why the person is selling has to be made public, the mention of noisy neighbours goes into that too!

We bought a house once, a semi-detached, everything was super quiet and of course the real-estate agent lied through her teeth.

We moved in on a Saturday and by Monday our semi neighbour was back, our kids were very young at the time and had their afternoon naps then, low and behold, I thought the house was exploding by the sudden piano music (hitting all the wrong notes I might add) started coming out from every pore of our house, through the very thin (less than 6 inches) partition wall.

Needless to say the kids went crazy by lack of sleep.... This went on Monday to Friday, 1pm till 9pm every blessed ones of these days for three months.

What we found out, was that our neighbour was a piano teacher at home piano teacher. This was failed to be mentioned by real-estate agency, we've got compensated due to by-laws mentioned above. Then she moved out, phew peace at last, and we got the partition wall fixed by agency, no cost to us, thank goodness.

The place was empty for nearly a year, so it was quiet at last, then things started to change place in the house, I thought at first it was the kids, but I would check to see if the kids were near these objects and nope never happened when they were around.

This had started after about 2 years we've been in the house, and it got worse. The final straw, was that they had failed to let us know that someone had died violently in the house.

End of story, we've got compensated for that too, hubby changed employment and we gave the house back to the mortgage company. Never looked back!!

Wynter Myst

Hi,
did I get this right and Wynter Myst managed to get compensated for the seller not telling them that there might be a ghost in the house???
Amazing - what do sellers do who don't believe in ghosts? Or did you only get compensated because the seller actually _did_ believe in a ghost in the house and therefore wanted to move, but failed to tell you about their belief?

I know it's off topic for this thread, but I would find it very amusing if a seller would be obliged to tell me at a viewing that they sometimes feel a cold draft from the corner where the housemaid was murdered 100 years ago

Karen

Yes me too.
And compensation because a piano teacher works at home - wow those are truly impressive bylaws

To Karen and Velvet,

It was not the case of belief in ghosts or not.

To clarify a point, the seller (aka owner of said house) had already moved out and had handed the house over to the real-estate agency. So the agency were the owners/sellers of the house.

What happened is that they failed to mention that the reason the previous owner moved out was because the original owner had been out to work, came back at night, to find break-in and dead body (apparently two thieves broke in one killed the other and make out with loot). They had broke out of jail and one didn't trust the other (long story short but true -found by our lawyer).

So, needless to say according to our lawyer at the time, this violent death would have had to have been declared to prospective buyers, it was not. So compensation applies.

Secondly, same agency fail to respond properly to questions from eventual buyer us, to questions of noise level and quiet neighbours and neighbourhood, which clearly was not, with piano teacher on partition wall.

So, lawyer got us compensation, the laws are tough in that country, but dam straight (excuse the expression) it's a law that protects everyone who needs protection.

It was not a case of 100 years ghosts it was less than two years, and was not mentioned which was a big mistake from them.

Hope that clears it off. And by the way, you would want to your young children to lose sleep in a place that was supposed to be quiet. You have to think of the children peace and yours as well in some circumstances.

Sorry, I didn't explain enough first time.

Wynter

quote:

So, needless to say according to our lawyer at the time, this violent death would have had to have been declared to prospective buyers, it was not. So compensation applies.

I am facinated by this; how do they compensate for it? Are they compensating you for the fact that you weren't told OR are they compensating you for the tragedy which took place?

Its funny, this thread reminded me that -not long after i moved into this house- i noticed things were being moved about and i too supsected ghosts. Things were moved around, my new post was taken off the door mat and left in a tidy pile at the foot of my stairs, ironing from my basket would go missing for two or three days and suddenly reapear on hangers in my wardrobe, packets of cakes and biscuits were left in my bread bin, the list went on.

Then of course it dawned on me that we'd moved 1 mile from my parents house and my mom was coming round everyday to walk my dogs. Mystery solved!

Since you say 'real estate' I assume you are talking about the U.S.?

But nevertheless I do not understand how an agent, who never lived in the house, is supposed to know how noisy a neighbour is. Or indeed how they are supposed to know a violent death occurred. It is the vendor who is concealing information, not an agent. Sounds like compensation culture gone mad to me.

Long ago I lived in a house where the neighbour's child practised piano (badly) every afternoon. It was slightly annoying, but I didn't feel like suing anyone about it.

Baffled by this completely. Why should you have to declare that a total stranger was killed by another total stranger in one's house? What possible difference can it make?

We had the same nonsense in our house - apparently a neighbour of ours said she couldn't stand the feel of our house because someone had died there, and tried to spread the rumour it was haunted. Cold draughts, creepy feelings, the usual rubbish. Our house was built in 1640 - Right up to the start of the 20th century, if not a bit later, the majority of people died in their own house. Big deal. We've never noticed anything and we've lived here for 13 years.

quote:

apparently a neighbour of ours said she couldn't stand the feel of our house because someone had died there, and tried to spread the rumour it was haunted.

You are lucky lol as i've had this 'type' of neighbour, at least in your case i guess she wasnt too keen to set foot in your house. Makes not asking her in much easier.