We purchased a property last year with the intention of building a double storey extension to add extra bedrooms (lots of properties on road already had them, didn't think it would be a problem). During purchase usual searches done and questions asked of vendor, including "have you applied, been granted or been refused any planning permission on this property" the reply was "NO". We completed on the property and applied for planning for the double storey, paid out for drawings etc, got refused, we appealed, and got refused again. We have now decided to sell the property as we cannot get the bedroom space we require. In preparation for the sale, whilst tidying, I found some documentation that we received from our solicitors long after the completion date. Included in this was a planning history that states that the previous owner had applied for and been refused planning for a double storey extension! We were never given this info. We are livid, had we known this, we would not have purchased the house in the first place. My question is: Do we have any comeback? Is somebody responsible for this major mess and if so who is it? Please help!!
Your best bet would be to go and see a solicitor at a different firm (not the one you or your vendors used) and discuss it with him/her. Most firms will do a free or very cheap half hour first interview to discuss whether or not you have a case, how much it is worth, and how much it will cost.
Do bear in mind that litigation is hugely expensive and if you lose you are liable for both sides' costs. Your main case would more than likely be against your vendors and they would only be worth suing if they have very deep pockets. Also, it will be very easy for them to use caveat emptor (buyer beware) to show that if you were only buying the property on the basis of being able to build an extension, you should have spoken to the council yourselves before going ahead with the purchase.
Personally, I would just chalk it up to experience, sell up and move on.
Thanks for your reply. Our main grievance is that the vendor obviously blatantly lied about the planning and the solicitors didn't bring their findings about the planning history to our attention. Surely the fact that it was highlighted on the document means that it should have been queried. We are now selling the property but would not dream of hiding the fact that we applied for permission and were denied. We informed the agents selling the property for us and have made it clear to them about the situation with regards the double storey. This error has cost us dearly and all because the relevant information was not disclosed. As for "caveat emptor" (buyer beware) we had hoped that paying out for searches, survey's etc, would highlight any problems! (especially in this case where they discovered a problem and failed to mention it!!!)
Mrs K - I can fully understand how angry you are. What a cheap trick the vendors played on you! BUT - from a legal point of view and suing for damages, bear in mind that you are no worse off financially than you would be if what they told you was true. If they really had never applied for permission the result would still be that you had bought a house that you couldn't extend the way you wanted. I think that is the aspect the courts would look at, not the fact that you have been royally p*ssed off. It would be a different matter if they had told you that they HAD received planning permission and you had bought on that basis (though hopefully you would have asked to see evidence!)
As Joolz says - with no information one way or the other as to whether an extension would be possible, it would really have been best to speak to the council first rather than just assuming it would be OK .
I do sympathise but I don't think this would get anywhere legally.
Searches and surveys do not look at planning histories. Searches look at future planning issues which may affect the property and surveys assess the condition of the property. If you had let the surveyor know that it was your intention to construct an extension he could have contacted the Council on your behalf and carried out this work as an extra over and above the standard survey work. Your claim is against the sellers solicitor and possibly the vendor as you have relied on a statement made by them, but you bought relying on a 'no' which isn't the same as someone saying getting permission would be no problem. you could go to Court, but your due diligence would be questioned.
I really do sympathise with you, it makes you wonder what the point of replying truthfully on any legal documentation as everyone who has replied has said: it's hugely expensive to dispute it. I'm presuming that you wouldn't have bought if you had known you wouldnt get planning, if this is the case then you are out of pocket for the cost of moving, stamp duty etc. I was lucky in that the house I was considering buying to extend came under a council [South Glos] which lists all planning applications going back over 10 years [I think] on their website and I saw that planning had been refused. I then went to the council offices and looked at the plans they had submitted -and the previous owners plans too which hadn't show up on the website.-.and decided to walk away. Good luck with selling and buying your next one.
You have my sympathies. May I ask why your application was turned down, even though other houses in the road had been extended in the same way?
We too are in the process of buying a house to do a double storey extension. I agree with the others that surveys/searches cannot confirm whether you'll be able to extend. Also, taking a vendors word for it is not reliable either. So far we have spoken to a planning officer at the council to find out if there have been any previous applications/rejections (there haven't). We also told them what we are thinking of doing to get their opinion. The adjoining semi has a double storey extension at the side so we assumed we could do exactly the same. Wrong! Since next door was extended some years ago, the planning rules have changed and we now have to leave a 1.5 metre gap from the boundary on the upper floor making it not worth extending at the side. The planning officer was able to tell us what the new rules were and what was likely to be acceptable. We then got an architect to look at the property and he suggested extending the kitchen at the rear and building a bedroom above the kitchen which seems a much better option. In our area, you are allowed to extend 3.5 metres at the rear double storey. The architect was also able to advise us about potential issues the planners may have such as right of light. He seems confident that what we are proposing will be acceptable to the planners. I hope he's right!!
I know none of the above really helps you now but at least next time (if there is one after this!) you'll do a bit more homework. I'm afraid I don't know how you stand legally but hopefully some of the others will be able to advise you.
I would actually argue that from a legal point of view you are in a worse position. You have paid a lot of money to move house (Stamp duty, fees etc) which you are now having to do again. If they had not lied/withheld then you would not have to pay these fees again (2-4% estate agent fees!). Also you could be entitled to some compansation for the mental strainetc although that is unlikely.
Originally posted by bclark1: You have paid a lot of money to move house (Stamp duty, fees etc) which you are now having to do again. If they had not lied/withheld then you would not have to pay these fees again (2-4% estate agent fees!).
Sorry but I disagree bclark. The indication is that the buyer did not make any enquiries as to whether an extension would be allowed other than asking if a previous application had been made. As an earlier poster pointed out, even if pp had been granted in the past that would be no guarantee that it would granted now. If the vendor genuinely had not applied for pp then the buyer would materially still be in exactly the same position now. Sorry to sound harsh, but the answer to the question 'who is to blame?' must be the buyer for making a massive investment based on supposition and optimism rather than fact. The vendor cannot be held responsible for that fact that the buyer did not make the right enquiries of the right people. It doesn't make what the vendor did right - it was still a slimy thing to do - but they are not legally responsible for the buyer's mistake.
I think that the point here is not whether or not planning permission would have been granted or not. The vendors stated that they had never applied for planning permission when in fcat they had and been refused. I agree that the buyer should have enquired as to whether or not permission would be granted but the vendor deliberately misrepresented their position.
QuaintIrene I disagree with you. You are right that if the vendor had NOT applied for planning permission then the buyer would be materially in the same position, however they DID and were refused. If the Vendor had informed the buyer of this then they would probably not have bought the house as they specifically bought it so that they could extend. The fact that they were misinformed means that the vendors misrepresented themselves in forming the contract and the buyers are going to be out of pocket by having to move again.
The vendor should be held responsible if they submitted false information into the contract of sale. If they specifically answered that they had not submitted a planning application in the past, and in fact they had then they should be responsible.
Thanks for your replies. I think some people are getting a bit confused with what I am saying. We bought the house with the intention of building a double storey extension. We were refused planning and that is hard luck on our part, I agree. BUT the vendor lied about having applied for planning permission for a double storey and having been refused. I can honestly say that if we had known he had been refused planning for the double storey we would not have bought the house. We would have know that it was unlikely that we would get the planning permission so we wouldn't have invested in the house and further costs of applying for planning. I have made enquiries via my original solicitors and have found out that they were aware of the fact that the vendor's information regarding the planning didn't match the information that they received back from the council searches. Apparently they asked the vendor to confirm that he hadn't applied for planning and no further action was taken. They didn't inform us of the discrepency between the vendors information (which we had seen) and the council searches ( which we hadn't seen). Hope this clears up the facts.
I'm not sure what you want to achieve by asking the question "who's to blame". Are you intending to sue the vendor/your solicitor? If so, bear in mind Joolz' reply - it will cost you time, stress and money and may not be worth the aggravation for the result you achieve.
Posted by Velvet: I'm not sure what you want to achieve by asking the question "who's to blame". Are you intending to sue the vendor/your solicitor? If so, bear in mind Joolz' reply - it will cost you time, stress and money and may not be worth the aggravation for the result you achieve.
The title represents the fact that we are feeling quite understandably annoyed that we were not given information that would have been fundamental to the purchase. We are trying to discover who is to blame for the fact that we were not originally given the information. Obviously the vendor lied, so he is to blame, but the solicitors didn't bring it to our attention that there was a discrepancy between his answers and the information they received from the searches, so they are also to blame. We are the only ones who are not to blame, yet it has cost us thousands already and we are now selling which will cost thousands more. As for sueing people, no, but we would hope that if the solicitor has made an error in dealing with our purchase that we would be entitled to some kind of explanation.
I'm relatively new to posting on this site and just wanted some feedback on our situation, and to possibly warn others that things might not always be as they seem.
I'm afraid I don't know the answers but I think you have been treated shabbily. I hope you can move, put it behind you and it doesn't leave too bitter a taste. Good luck.
I have to say that if planning permission was that important for the purchase, then simply asking the seller if they have been refused really isn’t sufficient – I would argue that very little could be deduced from their answer (whatever it was), as what matters is how *your* application might be treated, and the people to find this out from would be in the planning department.
I understand you might want to establish 'blame' Mrs K just to sort it out in your own mind. Maybe you will even get an 'explanation' from your solicitor. But to be honest, it makes no difference now. All you can do is learn from it.
I sympathise because the vendor was dishonest and the solicitor was possibly inept, but I'm afraid I agree with phugoid. If I had been making that purchase and PP was vital to me, I would have contacted the planning office myself.
The refusal of planning permisson should have come up in the search. We had the same situation when we bought. Sellers claimed that they were considering applying for planning for an extension but decided not too. The search came back showing that they had been refused planning permission 6 months before. I agree though I dont think there's anything you can do though as it was really up to yourself to make sure that any plans you were considering were approved before you purchased the house. Also when we bought our solicitor sent us a copy of the search. So it was there for us to find the information.
You have my sympathy as well. I'd be more annoyed with your solicitor - surely that's whey we pay them high convenancing fees - so that they protect us from this kind of situation. I expect them to take care of all due diligence. So surely they breached their duty of care. Litigation is a risky option but I would request a refund of fees from the solicitor and complain about them to their governing body.
Thanks for all your replies. We had spoken to the planning department. Our architect went to see them about our proposal and the planning officer had led us to believe that our plans would be ok, suggesting minor adjustments that we should make, etc. which we incorporated into our drawings. We argued this point in the appeal but to no avail.
I get the impression that if you discussed it with the planning department before buying the house, and incorporated their suggestions, then the problem appears to have nothing to do with either the seller’s response to your questions or the solicitor’s handling of information. It’s more about judging the risks in the light of what the planning department said.
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