I'd like to say a little something about the size of the subtitles on foreign-language films. This is probably for the sight impaired. A friend of mine has sight issues and says the subtitles are just right for him to read. Any smaller and they would be unreadable.

Additionally, when BATTLE OF BRITAIN used to be shown cropped, they showed the title sequence centred slap-bang in the middle of the screen in its original aspect with English subtitles "intruding" into the frame.

quote:

Originally posted by Libretio:Yes, they still insisted on shoving I'M NOT SCARED and KUNG FU HUSTLE to the top of the 16:9 screen (PLEASE STOP DOING THIS!!)

I personally appreciate it; I'd rather see the entire picture with clear subtitles underneath than a vertically centred picture with subtitles matted over the picture. I get used to the higher picture frame very quickly, and it becomes a zero annoyance within about 30 seconds.

quote:

Originally posted by Libretio:
THE CORE was screened at 2.35:1 last night, which cheered me up no end. This does seem to indicate some kind of a turnaround at Film 4, doesn't it?...

I think they've finally realised that they're a film channel, and that people can get better quality images from Sky Movies or even DVDs. I have a funny feeling this has been on the cards for a while, but they've had a backlog of pre-formatted, previously licensed material to screen first.

A friend of mine has sight issues and says the subtitles are just right for him to read. Any smaller and they would be unreadable.

Any argument to the contrary is going to make me seem like a selfish curmudgeon, but here goes anyway (anyone who wants to throw manure can form an orderly queue after I'm finished! ): I honestly believe the subtitles can be made smaller, even if just a little bit. I've always found the subs on British TV to be legible and clear, even after my own eyesight began to slip a little, and I've often thought Channel 4's new subtitle policy was OTT. In recent years, they've expanded to an intrusive degree, and I wonder how partially sighted people were able to cope with the subs before the policy change. Of course, it may be due to the change in the shape of TV's, with the switch from 4:3 to 16:9, but given that TV's are now generally bigger, I don't think there's any need for the subs to follow suit. Don't get me wrong: I'm not arguing for a huge reduction, just a minor adjustment which won't look so intrusive on 16:9 TV's or laid over the top of 2.35 images (rather than in the lower matte, as happens now).

Additionally, when BATTLE OF BRITAIN used to be shown cropped, they showed the title sequence centred slap-bang in the middle of the screen in its original aspect with English subtitles "intruding" into the frame.

I think this probably demonstrates why Film 4 strips such movies across the top of the screen, because the larger subs are too big and take up too much room in a 2.35 frame. Unfortunately, the vast majority of BATTLE OF BRITAIN is in English, and I just couldn't get used to the large black band at the bottom of my screen.

I'd rather see the entire picture with clear subtitles underneath than a vertically centred picture with subtitles matted over the picture. I get used to the higher picture frame very quickly, and it becomes a zero annoyance within about 30 seconds.

To be honest, I think they're too intrusive, even on movies framed at 16:9, and should be reduced in size. Most foreign-language DVD's - whether framed at 16:9 or 2.35 - contain smaller subtitles and I've yet to see one which I considered illegible in any way.

I have a funny feeling this has been on the cards for a while, but they've had a backlog of pre-formatted, previously licensed material to screen first.

I've been wondering this myself over the last week or so, which may explain why the likes of PRINCE VALIANT and CARMEN JONES are still being screened in cropped versions. Perhaps Film 4 will renew the licence for these films in due course and ask for bona fide CinemaScope prints. I don't mind if they screen them at a compromised 2.35 (from the original 2.55), so long as we can see them at some semblance of their cinematic ratio.

On reflection, I'm wondering if the idea of Film 4 working through a backlog of pre-formatted films may not be the case. As far as I know, the channel regularly screened most films at the correct AR before they switched to free-to-air. As soon as the subscription-only format was dropped, they started cropping everything to 1.78, beginning with THE FIFTH ELEMENT. I'm assuming TFE was screened at 2.35 before the switchover, along with virtually every other relevant title.

Anyway, I'm not yet entirely convinced by Film 4's commitment to screening scope movies at the correct ratio. They've been doing fine the last week or so, and they deserve praise for that, to be sure, but I'd urge caution and vigilance.

Besides, I'd been *so* looking forward to seeing PRINCE VALIANT in CinemaScope (sniff!)...

Things are still going swimmingly at Film 4, with more 2.35:1 presentations than ever before, though I'm still a little cautious about announcing All's Well That Ends Well. I'm hoping AUSTIN POWERS: INTERNATIONAL MAN OF MYSTERY and STORM OVER THE NILE will be screened at the proper dimensions next week, though I'm not especially hopeful. It will also be interesting to see whether THE SUM OF ALL FEARS and WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL get the full scope treatment or not, since they've both been screened many times on various Channel 4 stations, always cropped to 1.78:1. As for Film 4, I think it has turned a corner, so I'm cautiously optimistic about future schedules.

For now, here's next week's potential widescreen casualties:



28 April - 4 May



Film 4

ANTWONE FISHER (Panavision)
THE APARTMENT (Panavision)
AUSTIN POWERS: INTERNATIONAL MAN OF MYSTERY (Super 35)

BUFFALO SOLDIERS (Super 35)

CLEOPATRA (Todd-AO) [2.21:1]
CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND (Panavision)

THE IRON PETTICOAT (VistaVision) [1.85:1]

NORTHFORK (Panavision)

STORM OVER THE NILE (CinemaScope)
THE SUM OF ALL FEARS (Panavision)

WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL (Panavision)

ZOOLANDER (Super 35)



Terrestrial / Freeview

633 SQUADRON (Panavision)

BLIND DATE [1987] (Panavision)
BOY ON A DOLPHIN (CinemaScope)
BREAKIN' ALL THE RULES (Super 35)

THE COCKLESHELL HEROES (CinemaScope)
COYOTE UGLY (Super 35)

DOMESTIC DISTURBANCE (J-D-C Scope)
DR.DOLITTLE 2 (Super 35)

ENIGMA (Panavision)

KIDNAPPED [1971] (Panavision)

THE MAGNIFICENT SHOWMAN [Circus World] (Super Technirama 70) [2.21:1]

PERFECT [1985] (Panavision)
PHONE BOOTH (Super 35)

THE RIDDLE OF THE SANDS (Panavision)

THE SCORE [2001] (Panavision)
SHAFT [2000] (Super 35)
SIMPLY IRRESISTIBLE (Super 35)
SUDDEN DEATH (Panavision)

THELMA & LOUISE (Panavision)
TOM HORN (Panavision)

ZEPPELIN (Panavision)



Next update: Tuesday 1 May

Note that WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL was also shown edited for language and violence before in an earlier slot. There seems to be a "PG/12" watershed at around 6-7pm, where it's acceptable to show mild language and violence. PRINCESS MONONOKE was shown in this slot in its Japanese version complete with multiple subtitled "b-words" and mild violence.

quote:

Originally posted by Some Person:
Note that WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL was also shown edited for language and violence before in an earlier slot. There seems to be a "PG/12" watershed at around 6-7pm, where it's acceptable to show mild language and violence. PRINCESS MONONOKE was shown in this slot in its Japanese version complete with multiple subtitled "b-words" and mild violence.

I'm not familiar with WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL, though I was surprised to find on checking with the BBFC database that it had been classified 15 for home video. This was due to 'moderate violence' and 'mild' swearing and sexual material. Now, here's the rub: The original theatrical version was classified 'A' (the 1970's equivalent of the PG) and was uncut. The cinema version ran 93m 52s, and the video version submitted in 2004 (running at 25 frames per second in the PAL format) clocks in at 90m 7s, which is exactly 93m 52s at 24fps. Given that it was a PG in the 1970's, I don't know why it wasn't classified 12 for a 21st century audience, or have standards altered so much since then?! Anyway, the film is due to be screened at 7.15pm next Tuesday night (1 May), so I wouldn't be surprised if it was, indeed, censored for broadcast.

Perhaps Film 4 needs some kind of manifesto for retaining loyal viewers, something like this:

1. All films must be screened at their original aspect ratio.

2. Wherever possible, all films must be screened using the original theatrical soundtrack. Latitude is given, of course, for films mixed and released theatrically in a 5.1 configuration (Dolby Digital, DTS, SDDS, etc.), which cannot be reproduced in current NICAM broadcasts. However, if the cinema version was mono, that's the soundtrack that should be used, not a souped-up 'stereo' version created for the home video release.

3. As far as possible, all films must be uncut and unedited. However, where a certificate has been issued by the BBFC, it's understood that commercial channels are only allowed to broadcast the version which has been passed for home video consumption. If that version was cut by the BBFC, clear warnings must be given beforehand. Similarly, if a PG-rated film is scheduled before 9pm and edited for any reason, viewers must be cautioned in advance. On no account must any film certified 12 or higher be scheduled before 9pm and edited to conform to pre-watershed standards.

4. Closing credits must not be edited, speeded-up or otherwise altered. To be fair, some of these sequences are incredibly indulgent and overlong, but on a dedicated movie channel, this should not be an issue. Voice-overs must be brief and to-the-point, and the 'squashing' of images to accommodate 'previews' of forthcoming programmes must be avoided wherever possible.

That just about covers the basics, don'cha think?!...

Believe me, if they screen CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND at 2.35:1, I may very well swallow my dentures in all the excitement!!...

Well, consider my dentures well and truly swallowed! Not only did Film 4 transmit Spielberg's epic at 2.35:1 for the first time on free-to-air TV in the UK, they did the same thing for the vast majority of relevant titles last week (21 - 27 April). Hmm, do I see a pattern emerging here? I think I do...

So, kudos to Film 4, which has rose quite sharply in my estimation over the last couple of weeks, though I'm still irked by the positioning of foreign language films at the top of the 16:9 screen (honestly, if people can clearly see the subs overlaid on 1.85:1 movies transmitted at 16:9, then surely the subs can be slightly reduced in size and laid over the top of a properly-centred 2.35:1 frame?).

Anyway, here's the list of movies screened at the correct dimensions last week:

ASSAULT ON PRECINCT 13
CATTLE EMPIRE
CLEOPATRA
CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND
THE CORE
THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW
EQUILIBRIUM
I, ROBOT
KUNG FU HUSTLE
THE NEWTON BOYS
ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE MIDLANDS
THE PROPOSITION
SOLARIS
STRANGE DAYS

And the few that weren't:

THE BRAVADOS
CARMEN JONES
HOWARDS END
MEMOIRS OF AN INVISIBLE MAN
PRINCE VALIANT

All of the latter titles could do with an upgrade (especially HOWARDS END, which appears to be a hybrid of the original 1.33:1 Super 35 negative, pillarboxed within the 16:9 frame and cropped top and bottom, so everything that appeared in the theatrical print is actually there on-screen, but with extra imagery above and below. Frankly, it's a mess, but if that's all Film 4 has to work with, it's hardly their fault. I'm hoping they renew their licence for all of these films in due course and provide correctly-framed versions, especially for the likes of CARMEN JONES and PRINCE VALIANT, both of which really need to be seen at full width to appreciate their artistry.

Anyway, even though Film 4 really does seem to have turned a corner (I'm still cautiously optimistic rather than flat-out enthusiastic), this thread isn't going anywhere. Vigilance is still required, and I firmly believe viewers should be made aware of what to expect before they sit down to watch a film on TV. This is especially true for all the other terrestrial/Freeview channels, which are still fobbing off licence-payers with cropped and cramped versions of movies which haven't been seen at their proper dimensions for many years (the BBC have recently run TIMECOP and THE MAGNIFICENT SHOWMAN in tatty-looking 1.33:1 prints, made worse by the fact both films were shot with genuine anamorphic lenses, cropping huge swathes of the original image - totally unacceptable in the age of 16:9 TV). So, call back here every Tuesday, when I'll continue to list the affected titles for the forseeable future. Besides, it keeps me off the streets of an evening, where I'd otherwise be mugging grannies for their pensions, etc...

I saw PHONE BOOTH last night, which was an interesting experience. The main picture was cropped, but there were plenty of 2.40:1 insets in the picture, and the splitscreen views were all left in their original aspect.

Oh, and Libretio, how did your dentures taste?

Like you'd expect a pair of grubby old choppers to taste!!...

Not the most edifying line-up on terrestrial/Freeview TV next week, though there's a few minor gems amongst the usual diet of repeats and ho-hum offerings. As far as Film 4 is concerned, you can probably guess which of the following scope movies will be screened at 2.35:1 next week (along with those that won't):



5 - 11 May



Film 4

ANTWONE FISHER (Panavision)

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW (Super 35)

THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT (Super 35)

THE MAN WHO WOULD BE KING (Panavision)

NORTHFORK (Panavision)

STORM OVER THE NILE (CinemaScope)

WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL (Panavision)



Terrestrial / Freeview

ABOUT A BOY (Super 35)
AGENT CODY BANKS (Panavision)
AIR AMERICA (Super 35)
ANYWHERE BUT HERE (Super 35)

THE BATTLE OF THE RIVER PLATE (VistaVision) [1.85:1]
BOY ON A DOLPHIN (CinemaScope)
BUBBLE BOY (Super 35)

CLIFFHANGER (Panavision)

THE FAST AND THE FURIOUS (Super 35)

GODSEND (Super 35)
THE GREAT RACE (Panavision)

KILL BILL VOL. 1 (Super 35)

THE LEGEND OF 1900 [La Leggenda del Pianista sull'Oceano] (Technovision)

MAID IN MANHATTAN (Panavision)

NEVER BEEN KISSED (Super 35)

OLIVER! (Panavision)

PAPILLON (Panavision)

ROAD TO PERDITION (Super 35)

THOSE MAGNIFICENT MEN IN THEIR FLYING MACHINES OR HOW I FLEW FROM LONDON TO PARIS IN 25 HOURS 11 MINUTES (Todd-AO) [2.21:1]

THE WEDDING PLANNER (Panavision)
WHO AM I? (Panavision / Technovision)*

Five is screening TO WALK WITH LIONS next week, credited as a scope movie in various sources (some reliable, others not so), but I haven't been able to confirm it one way or another, and the 4:3 version which usually plays on TV gives no indication of which format was used if it was photographed in widescreen (the difference between Super 35 and anamorphic is almost always readily apparent, but not in this case).

* Five US will probably be screening the same version of WHO AM I? they've always screened before, a 4:3 cropped version of the US edition, complete with edited narrative, dubbed dialogue and a whole new music score. If you avoid only one movie like the plague next week, MAKE IT THIS ONE!!



Next update: Tuesday 8 May

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear! Possibly due to an accident of scheduling, Film 4 was reliant on 'old' transfers for most of their scope titles last week (28 April - 4 May), which means we were back to the (not-so-distant) Bad Old Days when the majority of relevant titles were cropped to 1.78. Sadly, it also looks like the coming week will provide more of the same, even though the channel has (kinda) proved its committment to securing properly-framed movies wherever possible. Still, they deserve a Large Raspberry for all the reformatted titles which they broadcast last week.

Those that were screened at the correct dimensions:

THE APARTMENT
BUFFALO SOLDIERS
CLEOPATRA
CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND
NORTHFORK

And those that weren't:

ANTWONE FISHER
AUSTIN POWERS: INTERNATIONAL MAN OF MYSTERY
THE IRON PETTICOAT *
STORM OVER THE NILE
THE SUM OF ALL FEARS
WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL
ZOOLANDER

* The print used for THE IRON PETTICOAT was simply opened up top and bottom from the original VistaVision frame, adding lots of dead space to the image, which isn't as disastrous as the cropping/altering of 2.35:1 movies, though unacceptable all the same.

I'm a little hesitant to say things have perked up in terms of movie scheduling next week, as your idea of what constitutes 'worthwhile' material may be entirely different from my own. But there's some interesting stuff being shown nonetheless. I'm hoping all of the early CinemaScope features are screened that way on Film 4 after years of seeing them (or, rather, avoiding them) in cropped versions on terrestrial TV, either 1.33:1 or 1.78:1. Still, it's anyone's guess as to what gets screened correctly and what doesn't. See if you can guess from the following list:



12 - 18 May



Film 4

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW (Super 35)

THE FOOTBALL FACTORY (HD Widescreen)

GOOD MORNING, MISS DOVE (CinemaScope) [2.55:1]

JEAN DE FLORETTE (Technovision)

THE LEFT HAND OF GOD (CinemaScope) [2.55:1]
THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT (Super 35)

THE MAN WHO WOULD BE KING (Panavision)

THE RIVER'S EDGE [1956] (CinemaScope) [2.55:1]

THE WOODLANDERS (Super 35)



Terrestrial / Freeview

2 FAST 2 FURIOUS (Super 35)
THE 6th DAY (Super 35)

THE ALAMO [1960] (Todd-AO) [2.21:1]
ALL THE QUEEN'S MEN (Super 35)
ANGER MANAGEMENT (Panavision)
ARLINGTON ROAD (Panavision)

THE BIG CIRCUS (CinemaScope)
BILL & TED'S EXCELLENT ADVENTURE (Panavision)

DEMOLITION MAN (Panavision)
DRAGONFLY [2002] (Panavision)

THE EIGER SANCTION (Panavision)
ENTER THE DRAGON (Panavision)

FIRST BLOOD (Panavision)

HARLEQUIN (Panavision)

LETHAL WEAPON 2 (Panavision)

THE MEDALLION (Super 35)
THE MONSTER SQUAD (Panavision)

OCEAN'S ELEVEN [1960] (Panavision)
ONCE UPON A TIME IN MEXICO (HD Widescreen)

ROMEO MUST DIE (Super 35)

THE SCORPION KING (Super 35)
THE SUNCHASER (Panavision)
SWEET HOME ALABAMA (Super 35)

TOMBSTONE (Panavision)
THE TAMING OF THE SHREW [1967] (Panavision)
THE TRANSPORTER [Le Transporteur] (Super 35)

THE WEDDING PLANNER (Panavision)



Next update: Tuesday 15 May

I made another boob. Yes, another one! Honestly, there are more boobs in this thread than you'd find at a reunion of page 3 'stunnas'!

Film 4 went and showed me up something shameful last night by screening TO KILL A KING at 2.35:1. I had no idea the film was in widescreen (it looks like Super 35, but I'll have to check again to confirm), and I can't even excuse myself by saying I got it mixed it up with the 1988 drama TO KILL A PRIEST (shot in Panavision)! There are reviews of the DVD version online which also confirm the 2.35 ratio, but because the film isn't in my personal database of scope movies, it just got overlooked. Kudos to Film 4 for screening it correctly, and a Loud Raspberry to myself for not listing it beforehand. Now, where did I put my sackloth and ashes?...

Nurse, the screens!

Yet another boob for my ever-expanding collection:

Add THE TRUTH ABOUT CHARLIE (Panavision) to next week's listings, as it's being screened on ITV2 on Thursday night (17 May), very likely cropped to 1.78:1 - yawn!

(In my defence for not listing it earlier, m'lud, it was buried in the listings for ITV2. In fact, I had to borrow the Hubble Telescope just to find it within the depths of the Radio Times!).

Nurse, the screens!

Of the relatively few 2.35:1 movies scheduled on Film 4 last week (5 - 11 May), most were screened correctly (someone break out the bubbly). However, it was still disappointing to see ANTWONE FISHER turn up in cropped format (OK, put the bubbly away again), along with an umpteenth 1.78:1 screening of STORM OVER THE NILE (fer cryin' out loud, bring that bubbly back - I could do with a drink!). On the other hand, it was nice to see THE MAN WHO WOULD BE KING and THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT in all their widescreen glory, though both were curiously matted to something approaching 2.55:1, resulting in extra large 'black bars' on my 16:9 TV (all the other titles on the list were framed at the standard 2.35:1). The results were watchable, but curious nonetheless.

Those films that were screened at the correct ratio:

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW
THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT
THE MAN WHO WOULD BE KING
NORTHFORK
TO KILL A KING

And those that weren't:

ANTWONE FISHER
STORM OVER THE NILE
WHEN EIGHT BELLS TOLL

Sadly, more and more films (including 1.85:1 titles) are being subjected to the dreaded speeded-up credits syndrome, and not just during peak-viewing hours, when you'd expect Film 4 to be chasing viewers. For example, the late night screening of Jean-Marc Vallée's crazy-wonderful C.R.A.Z.Y. ended with the closing crawl hurtling up the screen at 150mph, rather spoiling the film's carefully-wrought tone of bittersweet poignancy. Same thing with TWISTED (another late night entry) and THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT (whose credits launched into warp-speed while some of the characters were still on-screen, with no attempt made to disguise the sudden acceleration). This really shouldn't be allowed on a dedicated movie channel, especially since some films get the speeded-up credits treatment, while others - with equally long crawls - don't. Less of this in future, please. In fact, none of this in future, thanks very much...

One last thing about THE LONG KISS GOODNIGHT: Am I mistaken, or did Film 4 screen a censored print for the various 9pm showings? The movie was passed uncut on film and home video with an 18 certificate, but some of the violence seemed a little... Abbreviated on Film 4. For example:

(Spoilers ahoy!)

When last seen in the movie, the character played by David Morse is still very much alive, but Geena Davis has taken the upper hand and is standing over him with a gun. She needs information, and she appears to aim her gun at his outstretched hand with the intention of shooting it in order to extract said information. However, in the version screened on Film 4, she doesn't actually fire the gun, which seemed a little odd, given that Morse was hardly going to volunteer his services. Am I reading too much into it, or was the film actually edited at that point (along with several other bits of violent conflict)? Anyone got the DVD version, to clarify matters?

Disappointingly, The River's Edge was shown in a cropped 1.78:1 print yesterday. FilmFour, what is the point? This has already been shown on either Channel 4 or More4 recently (or both). If we've already had the chance to see the cropped version with adverts, what on earth is the point of showing it again on FilmFour? I suppose the same will go for The Left Hand of God and Good Morning Miss Dove. We've seen these already on Channel 4. We have not seen them in CinemaScope.