The whole basis of religion revolves around the concept that humans are special, that god created man and the animals and plants and everything else are incidentals for the benefit of man. We are the centre of the universe.
Embryo science has just produced a man cow. How special is that? This new science is a threat to religion because it undermines God and it undermines the concept of creation.
If the Catholic church and other churches were being honest they would tell you that the real reason that they are opposed to embryo science is because of self protection and nothing to do with ethics. Science will eventually make religion redundant and opposition to science is merely a delaying tactic.
The thoughts of Chairman Al.
If a man takes no thought about what is distant, he will find sorrow near at hand.
I don't care if it hurts, I wanna have control. I want a perfect body, I want a perfect soul. I want you to notice, when I'm not around. You're so very special, I wish I was special.
The thoughts of Chairman Al.
If a man takes no thought about what is distant, he will find sorrow near at hand.
Of course humans are special. Evolution makes every creature special, adapted to the niche in configuration space it finds itself in. Of course, if everything is special, then being special isn't all that special
-------------------- If you feel like you're always in the dark - switch the lights on!
"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on." - Winston Churchill
AAhhhhh!!! Its not a man cow! Its human genetic material inserted in an empty cow egg - its just a casing that holds the gentic material. Sorry to rant but you know how the church twists things to control peoples minds!
Originally posted by CDarwin: AAhhhhh!!! Its not a man cow! Its human genetic material inserted in an empty cow egg - its just a casing that holds the gentic material. Sorry to rant but you know how the church twists things to control peoples minds!
Absolutely! nothing more than a bunch of cells without a soul .... or has it? does the man cow have a soul (even if it is tormented ), now that would be a religious dilemma.
Maybe the religious experts on here could help me out with the official line...When exactly do you get a soul?
The thoughts of Chairman Al.
If a man takes no thought about what is distant, he will find sorrow near at hand.
Originally posted by CDarwin: AAhhhhh!!! Its not a man cow! Its human genetic material inserted in an empty cow egg - its just a casing that holds the gentic material. Sorry to rant but you know how the church twists things to control peoples minds!
Absolutely! nothing more than a bunch of cells without a soul .... or has it? does the man cow have a soul (even if it is tormented ), now that would be a religious dilemma.
Maybe the religious experts on here could help me out with the official line...When exactly do you get a soul?
The catholic encyclopedia has a section on the soul and this is the first line:
"The question of the reality of the soul and its distinction from the body is among the most important problems of philosophy". I don't know about you but it had me in stitches. It's like saying that the question of the reality of unicorns is among the most important problems in zoology. This is what religion does to your brain -it screws it up to a point that you cannot tell anymore when you are being grotesquely ludicrous.
Originally posted by Chairman Al: Come on - we need some help here, does the man cow have a soul? - if not, why not?
I'm sure that in the bible you can find a passage that -if suitably interpreted- will give you an answer. And I'm sure that there is another passage which -if suitably interpreted- will give you the opposite answer. You just choose the one you prefer. That's what christians do.
The anti abortion faction will have you believe that the moment the egg is fertilised that makes it a human being and deserving of rights, and the right to live. Therefore, that must be the moment the soul comes into being as well.
******************************** John Smith: So what am I then? Nothing. I`m just a story.
Doctor: You`re an echo. That`s all. A TimeLord is so much more. A sum of knowledge; a code. A shared history. A shared suffering. Only it`s gone now, all of it. Gone forever.
Originally posted by Chairman Al: The whole basis of religion revolves around the concept that humans are special, that god created man and the animals and plants and everything else are incidentals for the benefit of man. We are the centre of the universe.
Embryo science has just produced a man cow. How special is that? This new science is a threat to religion because it undermines God and it undermines the concept of creation.
If the Catholic church and other churches were being honest they would tell you that the real reason that they are opposed to embryo science is because of self protection and nothing to do with ethics. Science will eventually make religion redundant and opposition to science is merely a delaying tactic.
We can hypothesise this way and that, but at the end of the day, only God is judge!
Mixing a cow and a human would not happen in nature; it is not possible! Only mans warped sense of tinkering with Gods creation, brings about this sort of scenario which has no benefit to mankind!
Science is coming full-circle and in fact will testify to there being a Creator - just a matter of time!
Science IS your religion, by the sound of things? But what will it really give you in the end?
Originally posted by Angelus the Vampire: The anti abortion faction will have you believe that the moment the egg is fertilised that makes it a human being and deserving of rights, and the right to live. Therefore, that must be the moment the soul comes into being as well.
Saw an amazing picture the other week. A picture of a surgeon operating on a young woman's womb - there was a 23 week-old baby inside and it reached out of the womb and clutched the surgeons finger.
23 weeks old and you can abort up to 24 weeks? Should not be allowed should it?
Originally posted by RedJooles: Mixing a cow and a human would not happen in nature; it is not possible!
So what are you saying? Surely the church argument is against mucking with fertilised 'humans' - is a mancow a human or not? If it is not a human then what is it and why should the church be 'bovvered'?
So the church is only interested in natural insemination in your world? What does that mean for test tube babies - have they got a soul and when did they get it?
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Originally posted by RedJooles: Only mans warped sense of tinkering with Gods creation, brings about this sort of scenario which has no benefit to mankind!
So you think that scientists are just having a laugh? playing around with no intention of actually finding cures for Alzheimers or Parkinsons?
quote:
Originally posted by RedJooles: Science is coming full-circle and in fact will testify to there being a Creator - just a matter of time!
Interesting theory and a good demonstration of head in sand syndrome. I believe that they are working for a cure for that too!
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Originally posted by RedJooles: Science IS your religion, by the sound of things? But what will it really give you in the end?
Science can never be a religion because it is adaptable and non dogmatic (with the possible exception of climate science )
The thoughts of Chairman Al.
If a man takes no thought about what is distant, he will find sorrow near at hand.
Originally posted by Chairman Al: The whole basis of religion revolves around the concept that humans are special, that god created man and the animals and plants and everything else are incidentals for the benefit of man. We are the centre of the universe.
Embryo science has just produced a man cow. How special is that? This new science is a threat to religion because it undermines God and it undermines the concept of creation.
Gods are tribal. At the basis of religions is the notion that a certain tribe is special. Everybody else is not. What tribe are the man and the cow you mention? Are they israelites? If they are not, then Yahweh doesnt want to have anything to do with them and probably they dont have a soul. They are soulless.
Originally posted by Chairman Al: The whole basis of religion revolves around the concept that humans are special, that god created man and the animals and plants and everything else are incidentals for the benefit of man. We are the centre of the universe.
Embryo science has just produced a man cow. How special is that? This new science is a threat to religion because it undermines God and it undermines the concept of creation.
Gods are tribal. At the basis of religions is the notion that a certain tribe is special. Everybody else is not. What tribe are the man and the cow you mention? Are they israelites? If they are not, then Yahweh doesnt want to have anything to do with them and probably they dont have a soul. They are soulless.
For someone who doesn't believe in God you seem very angry with him.
God did not call the people of Israel from the world, he called them for the world; to be a light to the nations, salt of the earth, leven in the dough, and a fitting respecticle for Christ
Human beings must be known to be loved; but Divine beings must be loved to be known. Blaise Pascal
So what are you saying? Surely the church argument is against mucking with fertilised 'humans' - is a mancow a human or not? If it is not a human then what is it and why should the church be 'bovvered'?
So the church is only interested in natural insemination in your world? What does that mean for test tube babies - have they got a soul and when did they get it?
Do you think it's human? What does it look like this man-cow?
Test tube babies are all human; human egg, human sperm, human baby pops out 9 months later! Couple's that had the heartache of not being able to have kids, can now have them!
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So you think that scientists are just having a laugh? playing around with no intention of actually finding cures for Alzheimers or Parkinsons?
Not having a laugh, but I question their methods. There is probably another way of healing these conditions!
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Interesting theory and a good demonstration of head in sand syndrome. I believe that they are working for a cure for that too!
A cure for someone with their head in the sand? A good hard yank from behind should do it, and 'pop' out comes the head! Thing is, you need to remove your own head out of the concrete block you've got yours stuck in... seemed all pleasurably soft and gooey at first, but soon set solid... sledgehammer needed!
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Science can never be a religion because it is adaptable and non dogmatic (with the possible exception of climate science).
But its followers exhibit some similar characteristics and demonstrate high levels of arrogance (Dawkins for e.g.)!!
For someone who doesn't believe in God you seem very angry with him.
God did not call the people of Israel from the world, he called them for the world; to be a light to the nations, salt of the earth, leven in the dough, and a fitting respecticle for Christ
LOL. Why is it that all these deluded theists have the idea that us atheists are angry with their god? I was just trying to establish some criteria to determine whether the mancow has a soul or not. I think it is clear that Yahweh would not grant this creature a soul. He would probably instruct his people to kill all mancows, destroy their temples and burn their cities. By the way, what is a respecticle? I guess it is a respectful receptacle. Nice word.
Originally posted by Have a Word: For someone who doesn't believe in God you seem very angry with him.
LOL, theists just love to take this strawman out and bash it, no matter how many times it's called. The issue is not with God, but with the belief in it. Do you see how they're different? Do you? Can you? See? That they're different? As in "not the same"? That they refer to completely different things? That they are, in fact, disjunctions? That to insist that they are equivalent is fallacious?
-------------------- If you feel like you're always in the dark - switch the lights on!
"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on." - Winston Churchill
Originally posted by RedJooles: Not having a laugh, but I question their methods. There is probably another way of healing these conditions!
Care to enlighten us with your insight. Medical science is clearly in need of your assistance as it probably didn't think to cure these conditions with the 'other way' when it could use that as an excuse to muck about with genetics. What a loss to humankind it is that you don't work in medical science.
Originally posted by Have a Word: For someone who doesn't believe in God you seem very angry with him.
LOL, theists just love to take this strawman out and bash it, no matter how many times it's called. The issue is not with God, but with the belief in it. Do you see how they're different? Do you? Can you? See? That they're different? As in "not the same"? That they refer to completely different things? That they are, in fact, disjunctions? That to insist that they are equivalent is fallacious?
But why do you all get so excited about the whole affair. I mean why get angry with people who believe in God - or with "belief in God" (if you prefer). I mean shouldn't there be something of the Laissez faire about the atheistic position. Shouldn't there be something of the "hey well if that's your bad, what does it for you..." about your response.
But there is absolutely nothing laissez faire about you guys. Exhibit "A" - your above response.
Human beings must be known to be loved; but Divine beings must be loved to be known. Blaise Pascal
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), now that would be a religious dilemma. 
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