Peter Oborne and the programme makers will be live on this site from 9pm on Monday 7 July to discuss issues raised in the programme. You can submit a questions ahead of the debate below
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On the third anniversary of the 7/7 London Bombings, political commentator and journalist Peter Oborne investigates whether these attacks and the fear of terrorism has fuelled the rise of violence, intolerance and hatred against British Muslims. He discovers that for many in the Muslim community, Britain is becoming a very frightening place. Dispatches meets a range of British Muslims who now live in daily fear, some because their homes are constantly vandalised, others because they or family have suffered devastatingly violent attacks.
An exclusive ICM opinion poll commissioned for Dispatches reveals the extent to which Muslims have experienced hostility, abuse and prejudice since 7/7. The same poll also reveals the general public’s attitudes towards Islam and relations with Muslims.
Since the bombings there has understandably been much press coverage of the attacks and other terrorist incidents. Oborne investigates whether this coverage has had the side-effect of portraying Islam and British Muslims in a relentlessly negative fashion, leading to the demonization of a diverse group of two million people, most of whom have nothing to do with terrorism.
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This debate has been running for a long time in news groups on the web between muslims, jews, christians and those who have no belief.
It is not my intention to demonise, insult or otherwise demean anyone or their beliefs.
I personally believe in Jehova God (Yahweh) and Jesus Christ and his teachings and the source, the Bible (from the Greek, to Biblio, 'The Book', which is what followers were called in Muhammad's time, 'people of the book'.
As I said above, the quotes came from a source which was researched over many years and from many islamic writings.
I cannot point you to these sources as the website is no longer reachable, although the book is, by Craig Winn.
However, with regard to jihad, some quotes I have been given in exchanges in news groups debates: I admit I cannot verify these!!!
"Islam makes it incumbent on all adult males, provided they are not disabled and incapacitated, to prepare themselves for the conquest of (other) countries so that the writ of Islam is obeyed in every country in the world." - Ayatollah Khomeini (on Jihad)
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah, ... nor follow the religion of truth... until they pay the tax in acknowledgement of superiority and they are in a state of subjection." Qur'an, Sura 9:29
Bukhari:V4B53N412 “Allah’s Apostle said on the day of the conquest of Mecca, ‘There is no migration now, only Jihad, holy battle. And when you are called for Jihad, you
should come out at once.’”
I have also been told in exchanges, 'this country (UK) will be islamic' and 'the flag of the muslims will fly over 10 Downing Street'.
These I believe to be good-natured teases, there is no animosity in these exchanges!!
1) Ayatollah khomeini is not regarded as a reputable source of information.
2) That hadith relates to a specific time and place, which is actually given in the hadith. It was to signify the end of running away from those who were persecuting the muslims and the prophet Muhammad [pbuh] and now to take up arms - prior to this, the prophet and his companions had been fleeing from persecution for some time (I believe it was a year or so). It is by no means a general statement, rather it is considerably specific.
4) ''I have also been told in exchanges, 'this country (UK) will be islamic' and 'the flag of the muslims will fly over 10 Downing Street'.''
For the UK to become Islamic it would require a caliphate. At present, there isn't a caliphate in existence - there hasn't been one for several hundred years as a matter of fact, though that's a different story for another time. Also, given the current climate towards muslims and Islam in general, it is doubtfull that the UK will become Islamic any time soon.
Lastly, I would recommend you broaden your knowledge base and not simply rely on bias or anti-muslim/islamic views. At least ascertain the information from both sides, before you make a judgement on Islam.
As to the topic; I look forward to watching this one.
It's not only muslims who (might?) suffer. To those who don't know the difference all asians are targetted. What joe public doesn't know is that Sikhs despise muslims more than any other religion can possibly do so.
What joe public doesn't realise when targetting abuse to all asians is that we are not all muslim. Sikhs despise muslims more than any race on this earth.
You have produced a programme as biased and one-sided as the media reports you rail against. Meaningless statistics are thrown about like confetti eg less than 50% of British people do not have a Muslim friend whereas over 60% of Muslims do. Well what do you expect? Muslims account for only 3% of the population and tend to live in tight communities. Millions of British people in Scotland and rural areas never see a Muslim or have the opportunity to befriend them. Further, many Muslim women retreat behind the veil. Not exactly extending the hand of friendship is it?
A poor piece of journalism I am afraid that doesn't live up to Ch4 standards. The valid points you could have made are lost amid the strident bias of your programme.
As a German living in the UK, I have felt a strong disquiet about the way the British press and on occasion the British government has stirred up the public, leading to hostility and attacks on the Muslim community of Britain. Thank you for this program. This is long, long overdue. Progrom Britain is what I have lived in since 9/11. It has to stop!
Almost half of Britain’s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to “shed blood” for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.
Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain. The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.
One of the world’s most respected Deobandi scholars believes that aggressive military jihad should be waged by Muslims “to establish the supremacy of Islam” worldwide.
Justice Muhammad Taqi Usmani argues that Muslims should live peacefully in countries such as Britain, where they have the freedom to practise Islam, only until they gain enough power to engage in battle.
His views explode the myth that the creed of offensive, expansionist jihad represents a distortion of traditional Islamic thinking.
Peter, why did you not cover these stories in your programme and don't you think such stories add to the apprehension British people have towards what 'version' of Islam our Muslim population are being 'taught'?
Assalam alaykum to everyone, muslims and non-muslims,
It is the best time to be a muslim. It truly is. How can we be stronger, if we are not tested?
I make dua for the injured and dead and other victims of the dreadful actions of terrorists around the world, especially who claim to call themselves Muslims. I fear for them on the day of judgement, as I fear for myself and the muslim ummah.
I make dua for the muslim brothers and sisters who have been hurt, injured or killed as a result of violence from muslims and non-muslims.
Rest assured, England will probably never become a muslim country.
Can we not see that every human in a position of power still uses propaganda, a tool that has been used since human civilisation ever came into being...
And just something to think about, has ANYONE ever allowed or thought it was necessary to examine any other holy book, ie. the bible (with all the different versions) or the Torah in detail ie. to criticise.
The quran is perfect, unchanged and from Allah as the day he revealed it. It should be the last book on any such list of warranting examination to criticise.
Firstly i would like to say that i do not believe that muslims are terrorists at all!!!
However i do believe that muslims could become bad for the country. I can honestly see in 100-150 years that in Britain white christians being the minority, can anyone else see this?
I do believe that they can not take critisim, they do look down at pubs etc, stuff which is against there religion. I do generaly find this annoying, i have seen muslims on TV saying how much a sin christmas is etc, this was on bbc breakfast. I have also seen some pushing for sharia law.
This is unthinkable many of these people have come to britain as it is a better place. how dare they complain and demand for varius law changes. THIS IS BRITAIN we have are own cluture and traditions, we must protect this. when you travel to certain areas in the country i do generally think i am in a different country, this is wrong!
I am against the muslim culture in this country as it does damage britains. no one can argue that they have changed are culture!
I found the format of the documentary insulting. I, as many other people that I speak to are not really too bothered about terrorism, we have had large numbers of muslims in this country since the 2nd world war and there has been one Islamic 'terrorist attack'. I am under no illusion that 'all muslims are terrorists' which this documentary tried to put across as the opinion of the white population in England.
The problem I have, which once again is shared by many people I speak to is the Islamification (if thats even a word) of the UK. I dont want to see mosques as I travel to work. I dont want to eat halal meat, not because it tastes any different, it doesnt, I just dont feel that in England I should be sold. I dont want people at work to whinge about not being able to pray at god knows how many times in the day as the pre set break pattern doesnt allow it.
I have no problem with anyone in this country as long as they come to live in the UK, not try and convert it into something which resembles as rainy, grassy pakistan.
You have produced a programme as biased and one-sided as the media reports you rail against. Meaningless statistics are thrown about like confetti eg less than 50% of British people do not have a Muslim friend whereas over 60% of Muslims do. Well what do you expect? Muslims account for only 3% of the population and tend to live in tight communities. Millions of British people in Scotland and rural areas never see a Muslim or have the opportunity to befriend them. Further, many Muslim women retreat behind the veil. Not exactly extending the hand of friendship is it?
A poor piece of journalism I am afraid that doesn't live up to Ch4 standards. The valid points you could have made are lost amid the strident bias of your programme.
the point being made wrt 50% figure is that despite these people not having muslim friends and therefore not having first hand experience of muslims and islam the majority of non-muslims are hostile and base their perceptions on the prejudiced of the newsmedia and of course their bigotry.
I blame the gutter press (tabloids) for pandering to fear and fear-mongering and for hyping up the negativity towards Muslims. It's as if the likes of the Sun, the Daily Express and other papers have an agenda - namely, to drive out Muslims from Britain. I am not a Muslim. I am white English and nominally Christian, though I now consider myself to be an atheist. I lived for years in West Germany in the 1970s, which made me want to find out more about the Nazi period and how the Jews were maltreated. The newspapers then also played a significant role in spreading hate. One might even put a fair chunk of the blame for the Holocaust at the editors' doors, since they spewed the oxygen on which the hatred thrived. The Jews turned the other cheek. I think Muslims today need to confront this hatred, not hide away and wait for someone else to change things, else it will just get worse and worse.
Originally posted by M1dge: I found the format of the documentary insulting. I, as many other people that I speak to are not really too bothered about terrorism, we have had large numbers of muslims in this country since the 2nd world war and there has been one Islamic 'terrorist attack'. I am under no illusion that 'all muslims are terrorists' which this documentary tried to put across as the opinion of the white population in England.
The problem I have, which once again is shared by many people I speak to is the Islamification (if thats even a word) of the UK. I dont want to see mosques as I travel to work. I dont want to eat halal meat, not because it tastes any different, it doesnt, I just dont feel that in England I should be sold. I dont want people at work to whinge about not being able to pray at god knows how many times in the day as the pre set break pattern doesnt allow it.
I have no problem with anyone in this country as long as they come to live in the UK, not try and convert it into something which resembles as rainy, grassy pakistan.
Do you really think Britain is being Islamified when only 3 percent of the UK population is Muslim? Does the selling of halal meat really affect your life?
Originally posted by Peter O.: Hello - I'm Peter Oborne and I'll be online from 9.00pm
Hello Peter
I have to commend you for a great piece of British journalism. The type of journalism that has been absent from our screens for too long.
What I would like to ask is whether you would consider a documentary which provides a deeper insight into current 'British journalism'? Especially the tabloid media, who is backing/funding it? It's agenda? and how we can ultimately reclaim true British journalism?
Originally posted by nyunyu: Can somene tell me why muslims never demonstrated against radical islams?
What is your evidence for stating this? Several big Muslim organisations condemned both the 9-11 and 7/7 attacks. Does anyone on this forum actually oppose the thesis of the Dispatches film - i.e. that anti-Muslim hostility and abuse has increased since 7/7 and Muslims are being singled out?
Originally posted by b122: Firstly i would like to say that i do not believe that muslims are terrorists at all!!!
However i do believe that muslims could become bad for the country. I can honestly see in 100-150 years that in Britain white christians being the minority, can anyone else see this?
I do believe that they can not take critisim, they do look down at pubs etc, stuff which is against there religion. I do generaly find this annoying, i have seen muslims on TV saying how much a sin christmas is etc, this was on bbc breakfast. I have also seen some pushing for sharia law.
This is unthinkable many of these people have come to britain as it is a better place. how dare they complain and demand for varius law changes. THIS IS BRITAIN we have are own cluture and traditions, we must protect this. when you travel to certain areas in the country i do generally think i am in a different country, this is wrong!
I am against the muslim culture in this country as it does damage britains. no one can argue that they have changed are culture!
you do realise and understand that christianity is a an alien culture and religion, that it has been imported from the middle east and that jesus was most probably an 'arab' .
as for culture, how do you prevent a change of culture when globalisation is in full flow, how do you stop goods and services from around the world from being imported into the uk and thus change its culture?
id suggest that neighbours, hollywood, mcdonalds and starbucks have done more to change british culture than any thing muslims have brought to this country.
and when you talk about culture do you intend to bring back that age old tradition of dunk a witch, the stocks and sending young uns up chimneys or do you think that culture and the way of life actually evolves.
if we are losing our culture then maybe its not worth saving, its a free country if people want it they'd keep it but they are voting with their burgers and coffees if you ask me.
Originally posted by RDeol: The reality is that muslims are reaping what they have sown.
When you say they are reaping what they have sown, do you mean that all 1.8 million British Muslims are being punished for the crimes of four Muslim men on 7/7?
Originally posted by M1dge: I found the format of the documentary insulting. I, as many other people that I speak to are not really too bothered about terrorism, we have had large numbers of muslims in this country since the 2nd world war and there has been one Islamic 'terrorist attack'. I am under no illusion that 'all muslims are terrorists' which this documentary tried to put across as the opinion of the white population in England.
The problem I have, which once again is shared by many people I speak to is the Islamification (if thats even a word) of the UK. I dont want to see mosques as I travel to work. I dont want to eat halal meat, not because it tastes any different, it doesnt, I just dont feel that in England I should be sold. I dont want people at work to whinge about not being able to pray at god knows how many times in the day as the pre set break pattern doesnt allow it.
I have no problem with anyone in this country as long as they come to live in the UK, not try and convert it into something which resembles as rainy, grassy pakistan.
so what you want is people to commend you on your intolerance and prejudices as if it is a badge of honour .. right?
Topic Closed
