Hi Hysteria

A similar thing happened to me. I was demand feeding, every 1-2 hours for the first week and a half. Basically, a Midwife who was a strong advocate of bf told me to supplement with formula which i did. I was also pumping milk very regularly to keep up supply, when i tried to put Katie back on the breast she would not have any of it, would cry and turn away. I was still pumping and found my milk supply getting less and less so I had no other choice but formula. You can't give the baby what you don't have! I would definitely try bf again, and hopefully will know what to expect.

sorry i missed a bit. The Midewife told me to supplement with formula as Katie was loosing weight, not thriving.

Hysteria 1983:

I think you should be immensely proud of yourself, (what would you say to me if the shoe was on the other foot?). I also know thats easier said than done, but make a conscious effort to keep telling yourself how well you did - in time you'll be able to 'feel' that way about it.

I know you're feeling let-down, and I get a sense you feel cheated by your own body. When you feel able, it might help to look into what happened again - contact your clinic and arrange to talk again to midwives, consultants, doctors - this might help you cope better with all the feelings you have. After a really traumatic birth experience, I had a meeting with my consultant. I spent my whole labour in a blind panic, reacted severely to the hormones they gave me, and hemorrhaged too - I felt much better after going through my notes, as I 'understood' what had happened more.

Be gentle with yourself, and keep talking when you get down x

Thank you all for the kind words.
I did feel let down by my body, and posting on here does help me to understand I was doing my best.
I was really upset with myself for months after as my friend wha had a baby girl the same age was BF really well, but I am now begining to come to terms with the fact that we both did the best we could at BF.
I think I really have to think about what I actually went through those first few weeks to make myself proud.
But I would have done anything in thw hole world to have made him better.

Sorry about the poor spelling there everyone. No excuse, just typing to fast. (Being lazy)

I never breast fed either of my babies, although I was advised that 'breast was best' it was'nt pushed onto me like it seems to be now. One mid-wife even told me (off the record) the only reason they advise breast feeding is because it saves our government money in free formuler, not sure I believe her but that was her veiw on it.

I never liked the idea of breast feeding and for selfish reasons bottle feeding was great. I had this irational desire to have my body back, not in a vanity sense but because I hated the feeling of my body not being my own anymore. Also my OH loved being involved with the feeding and I was'nt run down due to that.

I'm aware now of all the benefits of breast feeding and admittedly I do have pangs of guilt for not trying but my kids are happy HEALTHY and loved. So whats the problem?

No baby has ever been harmed by having formuler, the way some of you talk you'd think mums were feeding they're babies on Redbull.

quote:

Originally posted by *Dr Melphy*:No baby has ever been harmed by having formuler, the way some of you talk you'd think mums were feeding they're babies on Redbull. Get a grip!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3359427.stm



http://www.mamadearest.ca/en/info/risk_and_costs.htm

http://www.lancaster.gov.uk/News.asp?id=SX9452-A78075D0

http://www.info.doh.gov.uk/doh/EmBroadcast.nsf/f011981a...04cc551?OpenDocument

http://www.lancaster.gov.uk/PressRelease.asp?id=SX9452-A7800479

From a personal point of view, my youngest daughter would definately have been harmed if she had been given formula, as she is allergic to cows milk protien, as are 1 in 5 babies. Reflux, colic, excema, constipation, diabetes, just a few things that are caused or triggered by cows milk, ie, formula.

This may sound like a daft question, but are all formula milks based on cow's milk?
I used a milk provided by my clinic when I had to put my son onto formula, but I didn't think it was cow's milk based, I'm sute it said, based on Breast Milk. That may have just been for advertising though.

Most are cows milk and some are based on soy. As far as I know.

All well and good if you are able to produce milk, formula is there as a back up to sustain a baby. It is not like it used to be 30-40 years ago, it has got a lot better. They add probiotics to aid digestion, however it is not superior to breastmilk. I only wish i could have sustained bf.

Pigletmania, it's a worthy back up if you can't do it any other way. I'm sure that formula is continually being improved, I just think it was very unwise and ignorant of Dr Melphy to say that it isn't EVER harmful to babies.
As said in my previous post, sometimes breastmilk IS harmful to babies just not as frequently. On a par, it's virtually unheard of.

Allergies can easily be triggered from breastmilk. As I've said before, I was breastfed and have a list of allergies as long as my arm. Allergies are often down to an overactive immune system: that is, one which considers harmless foreign particles as dangerous and develops an immune response. Often allergies develop later in life: for example hay fever. Environment also plays a big part: people who live in sterile homes are often more prone to illness and allergies than those whose parents aren't so fussy. There's a whole host of factors that contribute to the development of such problems, not just what you were fed as a baby

I can understand that BF boosts the immune system, and helps fight illness. But I can's say that is stops you getting any allergies. IT is down to geneticsas well. If it were a case that if you BF your would DEFINATLY never get eczema, or athsma, or allergies to other substances. It would also be reffered to as 'magic juice', as I don't think there are many cases that could prove BF stops any of this happening. My mother BF all 3 of my siblings, plus myself.
I have Eczema, my brother has eczema, my sister has a lils of allergies as long as her arm, one of the extreme ones being an allergy to silver. (not a food substance I know) but just as important in daily life. She is also overweight, something that BF is help not be a problem.
My Eldest brother has some terrible emotional problems, and he was BF the longest, while BF is said to make the child emotional secure because of the strong bond it produces.
I also have Eczema, and suffer with regular respetory infections, and was also admittedto hospital for many weeks at the age of 4 because of a really bad bout of gastroenteritis.
I was ill lot's as a child. so what did BF do for me.... Nothing I feel.
I think there are too many factors for BF to be said it is the sole producer to stop any of thid happening. YES it is better (superior) than formula, YES it's free, Yes it's there on tap, at the right temp.
And YES I did bf my son for as long as I could, (who also has terrible eczema) but I do not think it is the magic substance that it is said to be.
I would love to BF again, but if I didn't for some physical reason (if baby was really ill) Then I no longer feel as though I would be seriously compramising my child's health.
No more than a parent who smokes, drinks, gives there child crap to eat, neglects there emotional needs.
The best thing I have done for my babies is to always be there when they need me most. Which is all the time. With the exception of my first night out alone in almost 2 years, which is happening this christmas!!!

Hysteria1983 - enjoy your night out!!x I and my partner have a Christmas night out planned also and am soooo excited! At least having kids makes you really appreciate a night out and for me, time together with my partner.

Hysteria1983 - most eczema, other skin and respiratory conditions are relieved by removing dairy products from one's diet.
I'm not saying it's a fail-safe cure but cows milk introduced to the diet before the age of 18 months or so can cause devastating effects, this can also happen via breastmilk if the mother has dairy produce in her diet. It's more unlikely to affect a baby this way than by giving them formula but CAN happen.
I'm not going to be holier than thou (for a change) but would like to offer an example, obviously not a scientifically proven one but, nevertheless, I had no dairy products at all when breastfeeding - I have never had - to put it delicately- snot-faced kids. Most of the other breastfeeding mothers that I knew when mine were small DID have dairy products in their diets and their babies were always snotty.
I'm not trying to make this all about breast vs ff here, simply reacting and responding to your problems that you've unfortunately suffered with.

That said, I hope you enjoy your night out! It's all so long ago for me now that I take my freedom for granted.

quote:

Originally posted by Continuum Momma:
Reflux, colic, excema, constipation, diabetes, just a few things that are caused or triggered by cows milk, ie, formula.

Triggered, yes, sometimes. Caused, NO, NO, NO!

It is not about bf preventing problems and formula causing them. This black and white picture of the situation is why people keep making the same statement - I was ff and I'm fine/I was bf and I'm ill - as if it shows bf isn't really better.

It is all about the risk and the severity. A higher percentage of ff than bf babies will get these problems (which are CAUSED by genetics and/or environmental factors). Of those who have these problems, the bf babies are LIKELY to have less severe cases.

Just out of interest, Continuum Momma - are you and your family vegan? Or was your daughter 'harmed' by dairy products at a later date anyway? Which you then replaced, presumably, by a goat's milk or soy version (as would have happened with formula).

Oh, and have a good night out, Hysteria!

Exactly. It's like saying 'hayfever is CAUSED by pollen'. It isn't, it is caused by the bodies immune system overreacting to a foreign particle.

Formula is I believe often based on soy milk now anyway: rendering the cows milk argument against ff obsolete. I would also add that for most people dairy is an important part of their diet. Yes, SOME people will develop a reaction to it, but most won't. If we avoided all risks we would live in sterile bubbles, eating nothing and going nowhere.

I do agree Orange, i wander if my mum had bf whether i would not have the severe eczema i have now. She did try, but i did not latch on. In those days, way back in the 70's they plugged formula at the hospital when she had me, and did not encourage bf.

Pigeltmania - I think sometimes we have to accept that for some situations there is no rhyme or reason to it. I was ff and have never had excema. My partner was bf and had excema as a child, although not severe. I was advised to switch my daughter onto soya formula as she developed extremely severe excema (and I mean severe, ie weeping, bleeding, infected)which I did. It has made a huge difference. There seem to be more allergies nowadays than there ever were before...maybe it is because we have the capability of recognising them. I do believe though that we live in a world of central heating, pollution etc that was not as bad, say 40/50 years ago. There are many factors relating to allergies and these are just some of them, although a lot seem to be genetic.

I would not think that it was because your mum did not bf that you have excema...it could be a number of factors......

Hope Katie is keeping you on your toes....x

Sorry I should have mentioned that I was bf at the time that I was advised to switch formula.

Hi Karen

Yes i think you right there too. Just because a child is not bf does not mean that this caused their allergies. My grandma had eczema, so i guess it run in the family. Nowadays we are seeing more allergies, i think that it also may be due to living in a too clean environment where our immune system overreacts to allergens in the air. I guess there are some people on these threads that do make you feel a bit guilty about not bf which should not be the case at all! I also love chocolate too, and mabey eat foods that do not help it one little bit he he he!

Pigletmania - lol....I also love red wine and I am sure that I read somewhere that it is good for you!!!

we all have our vices he he he drink and be merry

hi oranjeb