quote:

Originally posted by rani:

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

quote:

Originally posted by Dogra:

quote:

Originally posted by Sanj Singh:

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The topic was started over the success of Asians in the U.K., who tend to be Muslims

No there are many, many Asian's who are not Muslim. Such as

Sikh's

Guarati's

And so many more, there are many different cultures in the British Asian communities in this country.

The cultures are not that different, there are many languages, but all speak English. Food has a few regional varieties.
Religion is religion it is a faith not a race. There are a number buffoons who claim 'hindus' are a race, really well how comes Guru Nanks parents were of the hindu faith, does that mean someones race changes when their faith does
These cultures are not separate or distinct, nor act in isolation. e.g. Punjabis, language food customs practically the same regardless of faith or nonfaith.
People experince the varieties available resulting in more of a merging of cultures, not completely but overlapping as some people will take on other regional practices like food.

Aryans invasion garbage has been rightly put in the dustbin of history:

Aryans

quote:

The usual explanation found in history books is that the inhabitants of the Harappan cities were driven out by the invading Aryans. However it is now recognized by scholars that the Aryan invasion theory of India is a myth that owes more to European politics than anything in Indian records or archaeology. (The politics of History, The Hindustan Times, Nov. 28 1993).

Citizen Dogra, always on hand to settle the score on all thing Asian. No wonder you are my minister for Asian affairs.

Er, do you think Sanj Singh is still drinking from the cup of that story about Aryans and Indians working in the sun, hence they turn Black?

Well if you spend all day in the sun it does effect your complexion.

So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience?

So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience? [/QUOTE]

I know that the orginal peoples of India are of the Aboriginal and Dravidian stock.

I was merely stating fact, (Its not rocket science!) people's complexion is effected by how much time they spend in the sun.

My complexion is 10 times lighter now then when I was younger, simply because I spent more times outdoors back then.

quote:

, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

Atila, as previously stated the caste system has nothing to do with Aryans, whose theory has been demolished and spat out of Histories back side into the dustbin.

link

quote:

These discoveries should help put an end to all speculation regarding the Aryan invasion as the cause of breakup of the Harappan civilization. On the other hand we now know that the Vedic civilization far from coming into existence after the Harappan, in fact ended with it; the mature Harappan civilization was the last glow of the Vedic age. This recognition has brought about a fundamental change in perpective in the history and chronology of not only ancient India, but also nearly all ancient civilizations. It helps answer several fundamental questions about the source of the Harappans - they should now be called the Vedic Harappans - and the age of the Rig Veda. Thanks to recent discoveries about the mathematics and geography of Vedic India, we are now in a position to answer both questions

Good luck to Arsenal tonight, see if Man utd and Arsenal can make it a gang of four for England.

quote:

Originally posted by Dogra:

quote:

, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

Atila, as previously stated the caste system has nothing to do with Aryans, whose theory has been demolished and spat out of Histories back side into the dustbin.

link

quote:

These discoveries should help put an end to all speculation regarding the Aryan invasion as the cause of breakup of the Harappan civilization. On the other hand we now know that the Vedic civilization far from coming into existence after the Harappan, in fact ended with it; the mature Harappan civilization was the last glow of the Vedic age. This recognition has brought about a fundamental change in perpective in the history and chronology of not only ancient India, but also nearly all ancient civilizations. It helps answer several fundamental questions about the source of the Harappans - they should now be called the Vedic Harappans - and the age of the Rig Veda. Thanks to recent discoveries about the mathematics and geography of Vedic India, we are now in a position to answer both questions

Good luck to Arsenal tonight, see if Man utd and Arsenal can make it a gang of four for England.

Indeed we have, citizen Dogra

I just wanted to make sure our nice pal Rani wasn't going down the line of those lies used to justify the racist caste system, that all.

Sad day yesterday, let's look 4ward to next season

quote:

Originally posted by rani:
So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience?

I know that the orginal peoples of India are of the Aboriginal and Dravidian stock.

I was merely stating fact, (Its not rocket science!) people's complexion is effected by how much time they spend in the sun.

My complexion is 10 times lighter now then when I was younger, simply because I spent more times outdoors back then.[/QUOTE]


Yes, indeed it does, however, the tan is only temporary not parmanent. If you are born Black or extremely dark in skin tone, that the way you stay until you die. I mean, the Spanish who live in Tenerife have not turn BLack over night despite living in that island for donkey centuries and you know how hot Tenerife is (close to the equator and next door to Africa).

So what your take on the Caste system then?

That bloody shiity shelpa should focus on campaigning against it in Indian, instead of being in denial about racism in India and trying to earn more bob down here, the over-rated ugly jezebel.

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

quote:

Originally posted by rani:
So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience?

I know that the orginal peoples of India are of the Aboriginal and Dravidian stock.

I was merely stating fact, (Its not rocket science!) people's complexion is effected by how much time they spend in the sun.

My complexion is 10 times lighter now then when I was younger, simply because I spent more times outdoors back then.

Yes, indeed it does, however, the tan is only temporary not parmanent. If you are born Black or extremely dark in skin tone, that the way you stay until you die. I mean, the Spanish who live in Tenerife have not turn BLack over night despite living in that island for donkey centuries and you know how hot Tenerife is (close to the equator and next door to Africa).

So what your take on the Caste system then?

That bloody shiity shelpa should focus on campaigning against it in Indian, instead of being in denial about racism in India and trying to earn more bob down here, the over-rated ugly jezebel.[/QUOTE]

I dont believe in the caste system never have never will.My parents never mentioned caste when I was growing up, its was only when I started mixing with other Asians that I became aware of it.

India would be so much better of without caste, but its the ones who are at the top of the caste system who will do eveything to keep hold of their status and use it to make them feel superior over others.

Oh and Atil, just because someone has a dark complexion doesnt mean they are at the bottom of the caste system. I know very dark skinned people are who are of a 'high caste' and rolling in it.

As for Shilpa, I was disappointed in her for denying and dismissing racism because it doesn't "exist in her dictionary", well it does in mine and plenty of other peoples lives.

quote:

Originally posted by rani:

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

quote:

Originally posted by rani:
So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience?

I know that the orginal peoples of India are of the Aboriginal and Dravidian stock.

I was merely stating fact, (Its not rocket science!) people's complexion is effected by how much time they spend in the sun.

My complexion is 10 times lighter now then when I was younger, simply because I spent more times outdoors back then.

Yes, indeed it does, however, the tan is only temporary not parmanent. If you are born Black or extremely dark in skin tone, that the way you stay until you die. I mean, the Spanish who live in Tenerife have not turn BLack over night despite living in that island for donkey centuries and you know how hot Tenerife is (close to the equator and next door to Africa).

So what your take on the Caste system then?

That bloody shiity shelpa should focus on campaigning against it in Indian, instead of being in denial about racism in India and trying to earn more bob down here, the over-rated ugly jezebel.

I dont believe in the caste system never have never will.My parents never mentioned caste when I was growing up, its was only when I started mixing with other Asians that I became aware of it.

India would be so much better of without caste, but its the ones who are at the top of the caste system who will do eveything to keep hold of their status and use it to make them feel superior over others.

Oh and Atil, just because someone has a dark complexion doesnt mean they are at the bottom of the caste system. I know very dark skinned people are who are of a 'high caste' and rolling in it.

As for Shilpa, I was disappointed in her for denying and dismissing racism because it doesn't "exist in her dictionary", well it does in mine and plenty of other peoples lives.[/QUOTE]


Always a breathe of fresh air, Princess Rani, no wonder you are my favourite younger asian of all time of here

Yeah, I have been told by my Asian female friends as well about how certain Dark skin Asians are at the top of the caste system. But in general, its mainly the darker shade Indians who are at the bottom.

Totally agreed with you on Shitty Shelpa, she is a bloody opportunist, here to make a few millions pounds and go back to India. She had no interest in speaking out against racism or even helping the darker Indians in her country who made her rich by watching her movies. She rather have them in her house as house boys and girls, serving her every needs


Like you, I cannot stand people who deny racism is going on or swept it under the carpet. But unfortunately, there's always a uncle ruckus in every community, prepare to do the racists biddings in order to earn their daily bread.

A former soldier who is a Tory MP had to resign his shadow post today after being caught out making racist comments. Behold, guess who came out from his former regiment to defend him and claim he is not racist? You guess it, Uncle Ruckus arse former Black soldiers under his command then

To be honest with you, I thought SS was fake as hell from day one and over-rated. I can tell you now, pretty, she ain't. I have seen far pretty Asian girls ion East London than SS and they often don't have tons of make up.

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

quote:

Originally posted by rani:

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

quote:

Originally posted by rani:
So, the indegenous people of India (who are the very dark skinned Indians) were once fair skinned.....until they started working the land and turn into darkies over night, then those fair complexion Indian arrive from the sky, started to lord it over them and before you know it, the caste system appeared, is that right?

You don't think they merely suffered the same faith as the Aborigines of Australian and the Native Indians of North America and Latin America?

Surely, my dear Rani, you don't seriously believe they (the indegenous Indians) were once pale until they started working the land and then had a reverse MJ experience?

I know that the orginal peoples of India are of the Aboriginal and Dravidian stock.

I was merely stating fact, (Its not rocket science!) people's complexion is effected by how much time they spend in the sun.

My complexion is 10 times lighter now then when I was younger, simply because I spent more times outdoors back then.

Yes, indeed it does, however, the tan is only temporary not parmanent. If you are born Black or extremely dark in skin tone, that the way you stay until you die. I mean, the Spanish who live in Tenerife have not turn BLack over night despite living in that island for donkey centuries and you know how hot Tenerife is (close to the equator and next door to Africa).

So what your take on the Caste system then?

That bloody shiity shelpa should focus on campaigning against it in Indian, instead of being in denial about racism in India and trying to earn more bob down here, the over-rated ugly jezebel.

I dont believe in the caste system never have never will.My parents never mentioned caste when I was growing up, its was only when I started mixing with other Asians that I became aware of it.

India would be so much better of without caste, but its the ones who are at the top of the caste system who will do eveything to keep hold of their status and use it to make them feel superior over others.

Oh and Atil, just because someone has a dark complexion doesnt mean they are at the bottom of the caste system. I know very dark skinned people are who are of a 'high caste' and rolling in it.

As for Shilpa, I was disappointed in her for denying and dismissing racism because it doesn't "exist in her dictionary", well it does in mine and plenty of other peoples lives.

-----------------------------------------------

Always a breathe of fresh air, Princess Rani, no wonder you are my favourite younger asian of all time of here

Yeah, I have been told by my Asian female friends as well about how certain Dark skin Asians are at the top of the caste system. But in general, its mainly the darker shade Indians who are at the bottom.

Totally agreed with you on Shitty Shelpa, she is a bloody opportunist, here to make a few millions pounds and go back to India. She had no interest in speaking out against racism or even helping the darker Indians in her country who made her rich by watching her movies. She rather have them in her house as house boys and girls, serving her every needs


Like you, I cannot stand people who deny racism is going on or swept it under the carpet. But unfortunately, there's always a uncle ruckus in every community, prepare to do the racists biddings in order to earn their daily bread.

A former soldier who is a Tory MP had to resign his shadow post today after being caught out making racist comments. Behold, guess who came out from his former regiment to defend him and claim he is not racist? You guess it, Uncle Ruckus arse former Black soldiers under his command then

To be honest with you, I thought SS was fake as hell from day one and over-rated. I can tell you now, pretty, she ain't. I have seen far pretty Asian girls ion East London than SS and they often don't have tons of make up.[/QUOTE]

Miss Shilpa Shetty, could help the 'dalits' who carry out the menial jobs, what colour there are or shade or whatever was never the key, as people in a particular climatic region cannot be so diferent in colour, and also the Aryan invasion is rubbish and disproved.

Saying that, discrimination does exist, and requires confronting.

BUMP

quote:

Originally posted by Lord Atiladhun:

Totally agreed with you on Shitty Shelpa, she is a bloody opportunist, here to make a few millions pounds and go back to India. She had no interest in speaking out against racism or even helping the darker Indians in her country who made her rich by watching her movies. She rather have them in her house as house boys and girls, serving her every needs


[...]
To be honest with you, I thought SS was fake as hell from day one and over-rated. I can tell you now, pretty, she ain't. I have seen far pretty Asian girls ion East London than SS and they often don't have tons of make up.

I'm no special fan of Shilpa, but I should say, to be fair, that she didn't ask to be thrust into the racism debate. Of course she came here to earn some money. Any 'celebrity' who appears on Big Brother is hoping to boost their career. That's the point!

She's an actress and not an intellectual or a social activist. Furthermore, before coming here I'm sure she had little understanding of British race politics. However, it's to be hoped that after all the fuss she'll become more aware of racial issues here and in her own country.

why is this a sticky?

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:


I'm no special fan of Shilpa, but I should say, to be fair, that she didn't ask to be thrust into the racism debate. Of course she came here to earn some money. Any 'celebrity' who appears on Big Brother is hoping to boost their career. That's the point!

She's an actress and not an intellectual or a social activist. Furthermore, before coming here I'm sure she had little understanding of British race politics. However, it's to be hoped that after all the fuss she'll become more aware of racial issues here and in her own country.

Something strange about the whole Shilpa thing. Like it was all staged.

quote:

Originally posted by Sanj Singh:
A major concern is that there is a significantly larger Muslim population in prison compared to other South Asian religions, namely Buddhist's, Hindu's, and Sikh's.

I hope you don't mind, but being an teacher I feel I should point something out to you re grammar/punctuation.

The 'apostrophe s' ['s or s'] denotes possession in English! So you can't write, for example, 'There aren't very many Buddhist's and Sikh's in prison'!

Here are some examples of how you use the apostrophe s:

The Sikh's hat is on the table; it's Mr Singh's hat, to be precise. He's currently having a debate with the other Sikhs in the living room. The Sikhs' discussion is a political one and is likely to last long into the night.

The Hindus of Leicester have recently welcomed Mr Gupta from India. The Hindus' intention was always to hold a big party for Mr Gupta. Mr Gupta's response to the huge feast laid on for him was one of astonishment. This humble, pious Hindu's gratitude to his co-religionists was very touching.

++++

So, generally, if it's a singular person you use 's:
This is the Sikh's hat.

If it's a plural you use s':
The Hindus' discussion was really noisy.

But if there's no possession involved, then you don't need an aprostrophe:

The Sikhs are in the living room.
British Hindus are making a name for themselves.

I hope this helps!

May I add my few cents regarding the race and economic wars in here.

It is true success amongst Asians whether from the old Indian subcontinent or China cannot be denied. Although I would have preferred if such success was replicated back home. The reason is because whether one particular group is a success or not, you will be judged according to what you are back in the "homelands".

I am currently a member of a professional body who sadly has to return many "researches" and articles from India because of "plagiarism". I just wish the education system in those countries was modified to encourage critical analyses to enhance creativity rather than encouraging memorising of facts which only causes repetitions and boredom.

This obsession with light skinned people is found in many Asian and African cultures although non has taken to extremes similar to Hindus and people of Judeo Christianity. This will sadly remain the status quo until the people of darker origin stamp their mark on this world with might and bravery instead of the current clownish culture.

fanx miss

quote:

It is true success amongst Asians whether from the old Indian subcontinent or China cannot be denied. Although I would have preferred if such success was replicated back home. The reason is because whether one particular group is a success or not, you will be judged according to what you are back in the "homelands".

Maybe I have missed something but people back home have become extremely successful have they not? The Tiger (was that correct use of a capital T Miss Dee)economy is one of the fastest in the world with no sign of slowing down.

quote:

This obsession with light skinned people is found in many Asian and African cultures although non has taken to extremes similar to Hindus and people of Judeo Christianity. This will sadly remain the status quo until the people of darker origin stamp their mark on this world with might and bravery instead of the current clownish culture.

You are right there is way too much focus on colour of skin. However I think the skinned people of South India have made their stamp on national and international society. It is predominately the South Indians who are responsible for much of the economical boom due to their expertise in computer software which has made India so attrective to large I.T. companies.

My main point of this article was to try to learn why there is so much difference within the Asian cultures when it comes to economical and academic success.
However the lack of discussion suggests that this is a topic politically incorrect or even too Islamophobic too debate.
The differences in this success is something quite concerning and even more concerning is the fact that we cannot discuss it.
Maybe it is because a non-Muslim has started this debate, somebody who may have ulterior motives.

Sanj,

Perhaps you are comparing yourself too much with the west or some other people. The Chinese say:
"He who copies, often has no traditions"

That Chinese saying concerns about inventions.

The success we all see are different to the success we all wish it was. For example, the IT companies you were talking of are all slaves to other companies outside the continent. Also, allowing graduates to quickly leave the country is a big No No.

Did locals invested in these graduates or America or Dubai?

I felt sorry to see men with higher qualifications all queuing up to become a wage slave in some little silly media house in Sharjah of UAE.

I would have forced them all to serve in the country for at least 10 years before they think of jumping ship.

So unless the solutions are home based and spent at home first, we may have to wait longer for the fruits.

quote:

... the IT companies you were talking of are all slaves to other companies outside the continent.

Yes of course one way or another we are all slaves, be it to these corporate IT companies, or our governments. Even the small farmer is a slave to the supermarkets and the purchasers of his goods.

quote:

I felt sorry to see men with higher qualifications all queuing up to become a wage slave in some little silly media house in Sharjah of UAE.

There are a great deal of educated people leaving the shores of their countries and contributing to the brain drain of their nations, however there are also a great deal of people staying especially in India contributing to the remarkable economic growth it has seen.
Bombay, Pune, or Banagalore the economic hot spots of India are all run by the local educated elite.
There are indeed many people leaving India but there also many returning home. In recent years I have seen quite a few Indian born immigrants return to their homleands to take a part in the economic boom.