Wouldn't it be interesting if the US got a black president? Then it wouldn't be quite so easy for Europeans to point the finger at American racism whilst ignoring the inequalities in their own societies.

Whether a black president in the US would have a positive effect on racial matters here, however, is another matter. Who can say?

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Blake2go:
Have Black Americans added to, or subtracted from, your life.
This is an open ended question, take it where you will.

Well if drive by shootings, ridiculous `street gangsta` clothing and misogynist and racist `music` is anything to go by then I would say that their effect has been `less than positive.`

But if you're that selective about what you call 'culture' you haven't asked the question, let alone tried to answer it.

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:
Wouldn't it be interesting if the US got a black president? Then it wouldn't be quite so easy for Europeans to point the finger at American racism whilst ignoring the inequalities in their own societies.

Whether a black president in the US would have a positive effect on racial matters here, however, is another matter. Who can say?

Yes it would, but I don't honestly think it's going to happen. I would bet that Obama will be baited, misquoted and drawn into making statements that will be spun by the republican media as anti-white.

I don't think he's got a chance of being the next president in such a racist country.

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:
Wouldn't it be interesting if the US got a black president? Then it wouldn't be quite so easy for Europeans to point the finger at American racism whilst ignoring the inequalities in their own societies.

Whether a black president in the US would have a positive effect on racial matters here, however, is another matter. Who can say?

What `inequalities` are these then?

quote:

Originally posted by Little RJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Blake2go:
Have Black Americans added to, or subtracted from, your life.
This is an open ended question, take it where you will.

Well if drive by shootings, ridiculous `street gangsta` clothing and misogynist and racist `music` is anything to go by then I would say that their effect has been `less than positive.`

But if you're that selective about what you call 'culture' you haven't asked the question, let alone tried to answer it.

Are you saying that black `gangsta rapper` streetlife constitutes a `culture`? In what way?
Would we not have to radically shift the permimetres of how we define culture?

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:
Wouldn't it be interesting if the US got a black president? Then it wouldn't be quite so easy for Europeans to point the finger at American racism whilst ignoring the inequalities in their own societies.

Whether a black president in the US would have a positive effect on racial matters here, however, is another matter. Who can say?

Yes it would, but I don't honestly think it's going to happen. I would bet that Obama will be baited, misquoted and drawn into making statements that will be spun by the republican media as anti-white.

I don't think he's got a chance of being the next president in such a racist country.

Come now, in a truly `racist country` he would not even be permitted to stand as a candidate.
The fact that he is goes to show how liberal American society actually is.
As European Americans are a racial minority in the USA I see no reason at all why such a candidate should not succeed.

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Little RJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Blake2go:
Have Black Americans added to, or subtracted from, your life.
This is an open ended question, take it where you will.

Well if drive by shootings, ridiculous `street gangsta` clothing and misogynist and racist `music` is anything to go by then I would say that their effect has been `less than positive.`

But if you're that selective about what you call 'culture' you haven't asked the question, let alone tried to answer it.

Are you saying that black `gangsta rapper` streetlife constitutes a `culture`? In what way?
Would we not have to radically shift the permimetres of how we define culture?

I don't think it would:

One definition of culture is: way of life, lifestyle, customs, ways, habits and mores.

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:
Wouldn't it be interesting if the US got a black president? Then it wouldn't be quite so easy for Europeans to point the finger at American racism whilst ignoring the inequalities in their own societies.

Whether a black president in the US would have a positive effect on racial matters here, however, is another matter. Who can say?

Yes it would, but I don't honestly think it's going to happen. I would bet that Obama will be baited, misquoted and drawn into making statements that will be spun by the republican media as anti-white.

I don't think he's got a chance of being the next president in such a racist country.

Come now, in a truly `racist country` he would not even be permitted to stand as a candidate.
The fact that he is goes to show how liberal American society actually is.
As European Americans are a racial minority in the USA I see no reason at all why such a candidate should not succeed.

I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK. I couldn't imagine an organisation like the KKK (I wouldn't call the BNP a true equivalent) ever getting the same foothold in British society as that they have in America.

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Little RJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Blake2go:
Have Black Americans added to, or subtracted from, your life.
This is an open ended question, take it where you will.

Well if drive by shootings, ridiculous `street gangsta` clothing and misogynist and racist `music` is anything to go by then I would say that their effect has been `less than positive.`

But if you're that selective about what you call 'culture' you haven't asked the question, let alone tried to answer it.

Are you saying that black `gangsta rapper` streetlife constitutes a `culture`? In what way?
Would we not have to radically shift the permimetres of how we define culture?

I don't think it would:

One definition of culture is: way of life, lifestyle, customs, ways, habits and mores.

Obviously your definition of `culture`.
I would propose the following:

1. the quality in a person or society that arises from a concern for what is regarded as excellent in arts, letters, manners, scholarly pursuits, etc.
2. that which is excellent in the arts, manners, etc.
3. a particular form or stage of civilization, as that of a certain nation or period: Greek culture.
4. development or improvement of the mind by education or training.

I would hardly classify black street `culture` as falling in to any of those categories, which is how any great civilisation would define the term.

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

Well, I'm not talking about them, am I?

If British is the adjective for all people of British nationality then 'Briton', (or more commonly, 'Brit', if you like) is the accompanying noun. What else would you like black people who are British to be called? I've heard the term 'Afrosaxon', but I suspect you'd object to that too!

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

Well, I'm not talking about them, am I?

If British is the adjective for all people of British nationality then 'Briton', (or more commonly, 'Brit', if you like) is the accompanying noun. What else would you like black people who are British to be called? I've heard the term 'Afrosaxon', but I suspect you'd object to that too!

Afrosaxon! What will they think of next?

I'd object to it as it's absurd.

Anglo-saxon means, germanic-originated people (angles) and saxon (saxony/jutland - also Germanic) who settled in the eastern part of England around 1000 years ago. As opposed to Romans, Vikings and Normans etc. I'm certainly no expert on these things.

However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Little RJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Blake2go:
Have Black Americans added to, or subtracted from, your life.
This is an open ended question, take it where you will.

Well if drive by shootings, ridiculous `street gangsta` clothing and misogynist and racist `music` is anything to go by then I would say that their effect has been `less than positive.`

But if you're that selective about what you call 'culture' you haven't asked the question, let alone tried to answer it.

Are you saying that black `gangsta rapper` streetlife constitutes a `culture`? In what way?
Would we not have to radically shift the permimetres of how we define culture?

I don't think it would:

One definition of culture is: way of life, lifestyle, customs, ways, habits and mores.

Obviously your definition of `culture`.
I would propose the following:

1. the quality in a person or society that arises from a concern for what is regarded as excellent in arts, letters, manners, scholarly pursuits, etc.
2. that which is excellent in the arts, manners, etc.
3. a particular form or stage of civilization, as that of a certain nation or period: Greek culture.
4. development or improvement of the mind by education or training.

I would hardly classify black street `culture` as falling in to any of those categories, which is how any great civilisation would define the term.

My definition is a dictionary sub-definition for culture. For instance, [1 & 2] is what I'd call 'cultured' rather than a 'culture'. A culture can be good or bad, depending on your point of view. You might hear the phrase "A culture of enlightenment", "A culture of ignorance" or a "Superficial culture", all still 'cultures'.

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

Well, I'm not talking about them, am I?

If British is the adjective for all people of British nationality then 'Briton', (or more commonly, 'Brit', if you like) is the accompanying noun. What else would you like black people who are British to be called? I've heard the term 'Afrosaxon', but I suspect you'd object to that too!

Afrosaxon! What will they think of next?

I'd object to it as it's absurd.

Anglo-saxon means, germanic-originated people (angles) and saxon (saxony/jutland - also Germanic) who settled in the eastern part of England around 1000 years ago. As opposed to Romans, Vikings and Normans etc. I'm certainly no expert on these things.

However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

Before anyone jumps all over this post I will add that the word '-saxon' in the sense I've used has about as much accuracy as describing modern black british people as Afro-norman, Afro-Roman, Afro-Angle would.

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
[However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

Does it have much to do with the racial mix of modern white British people?

By the way, I'm commonly what's referred to as 'black', but I have a Scottish great great grandfather. So do I have the right to be called a Black Briton? When I've traced my granny's family tree I believe I might find an Englishman: would I then be justified in taking the label of Afrosaxon? Or are we taking the view that one drop of 'black' blood taints the whole?

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
[However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

Does it have much to do with the racial mix of modern white British people?

By the way, I'm commonly what's referred to as 'black', but I have a Scottish great great grandfather. So do I have the right to be called a Black Briton? When I've traced my granny's family tree I believe I might find an Englishman: would I then be justified in taking the label of Afrosaxon? Or are we taking the view that one drop of 'black' blood taints the whole?

No, except perhaps people living in East Anglia and the Eastern side of England, who may but may not have descended from Germanic settlers in England around 1000 years ago. Bearing in mind, there was not exactly a lot of black people in England 1000 years ago!

That's the trouble with commenting on these subjects, it's enevitable that someone's going to gleefully imply that you are a racist.

So do you really think that Afrosaxon is sensible way to describe black british people (apart from those who have Germanic blood in their family dating back 1000 years) - bearing in mind I'm talking about black people who currently live in the UK - not black people who currently live in Germany!

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
[However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

Does it have much to do with the racial mix of modern white British people?

By the way, I'm commonly what's referred to as 'black', but I have a Scottish great great grandfather. So do I have the right to be called a Black Briton? When I've traced my granny's family tree I believe I might find an Englishman: would I then be justified in taking the label of Afrosaxon? Or are we taking the view that one drop of 'black' blood taints the whole?

It's just that Afrosaxon is a silly label because of what it implies. Saxon being a term for germanic settlers/invaders in England around 1000 years ago.

You ask if you have the 'right' to be called a 'black briton', why ask me? I'm just saying that Afrosaxon is a silly and inaccurate term that sounds very politically correct. And has the ring of "well Afro sounds a little bit like Ango, so why not?"

If you're black and you are from Britian then surely you're British, Black British, English, Scottish, Welsh or whatever way you want to describe yourself?

I call myself English but I'm really British.

If you can trace your family tree back to Saxon invaders/settlers then you can describe yourself as Afrosaxon, if you want, but I'd guess that very few modern black people can do that. For instance, if you have Scottish forebears why describe yourself as Afrosaxon when you could equally describe yourself as Afro-Scottish - as your Scottish roots are closer than your Saxon roots!

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

Well, I'm not talking about them, am I?

If British is the adjective for all people of British nationality then 'Briton', (or more commonly, 'Brit', if you like) is the accompanying noun. What else would you like black people who are British to be called? I've heard the term 'Afrosaxon', but I suspect you'd object to that too!

`Saxon` is an ethnic not a political term. Only those of Saxon descent may rightfully refer to themselves as such.
I concede that `briton` may be used in a political sense to designate a subject of Britain but `nationality` is a misnomer in this context as the term properly used infers a line of common genetic descent. I think it more appropriate for the term `citizen` of Britain to be used or British citizen.

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by Tarnhari:

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Dee:

quote:

Originally posted by ugetmi:
I didn't say that America was a truly racist country, but it has, IMO far more racial conflict and division than the UK.

Yet the funny thing is, no Black Briton has ever got anywhere near even being considered as a potential prime minister of our country! If Obama doesn't make it to the top job, he'll still have done far better than any black politician in our supposedly less racist country!

It's a funny world.

What is a `Black Briton`?
The `Britons` were an ancient preAnglo-Saxon Celtic people whose descendants now are numbered among the ethnically Welsh and Cornish.

Well, I'm not talking about them, am I?

If British is the adjective for all people of British nationality then 'Briton', (or more commonly, 'Brit', if you like) is the accompanying noun. What else would you like black people who are British to be called? I've heard the term 'Afrosaxon', but I suspect you'd object to that too!

Afrosaxon! What will they think of next?

I'd object to it as it's absurd.

Anglo-saxon means, germanic-originated people (angles) and saxon (saxony/jutland - also Germanic) who settled in the eastern part of England around 1000 years ago. As opposed to Romans, Vikings and Normans etc. I'm certainly no expert on these things.

However, '-saxon' has nothing to do with the racial mix or orgins of modern black british people.

Absolutely correct!
I would add that the Germanic colonisation of Britain began in earnest around the mid 5th century CE and continued up until the 11th century. The Danes and even the Normans[Norsemen] being of Germanic blood.
Sussex, Wessex, Essex indicate areas of Saxon settlement.
The Saxons originated from Lower Saxony in northwest Germany, bordering on the Netherlands.