Hi - frightening viewing. I cannot beleieve people seem to accept this so easily. Aside from technology being very questionable - I was subjected to over 80 claims for congestion charge when I could prove I, and my car, were in France - I fear for future of our nation.
I thought the show was very good and resisted the dive into paranoia, that many people make with this subject. I think the technology behind all this is very questionable. They want us all to use biometrics for ID cards and passports yet the technology isn't quite up to scratch yet. I read somewhere that verifying biometrics still has quite a high failure rate. Also instesd of testing the technology properly they seem to want to just roll it out. and see what problems come up. and fix it on the fly?
So the whole ID card thing seems to be a rushed job. And I don't think the governmnet has even thought about the erosion of civil liberties. They've been too busy trying to get the thing together to worry about that.
what a fantastic show ,i think the only people we really have to worry about is our own goverment yet another way of keeping the normal public where they want us whatever next. We will loose all rights to think,speak,anything a very scary future for us all
Come on strawberries thats a little over the top. I mean this governmnet may be incompetent in many ways and care free with our liberties but I don't think we'll lose the right to think or speak under them.
However I take the point that if we continue on this course of civil liberty erosion. It may lead to future governmnets making life difficult for those that speak out against it. Like the programme demonstrated with the two US anti war jounalists who were placed on a list that prevented them from flying.
It seems all here agree,the main problem is all those that say "If you have nothing to hide,I don't have a problem" which I suspect may be the majority of opinion,unfortunately.
And yes,strawberries is correct to be concerned , as it does seem RFID or something similar is definitely on the cards for implanting in humans,in the not too distant future!
Incompetent with our liberties,I don't buy that,clearly deliberate and intentional I'm sure.
Investigate 'Common Purpose'
"The people will believe what the media tells them they believe." George Orwell
I don't think they've set out to delibaratly wreck our civil liberties though they are incompetent in letting it happen as a side effect to thier anti terror, immigration and respect agenda.
I'm not defending thier decisions. I just don't buy the argument that some people suggest that this government is out to tear up our civil liberties, so they can get at us. I'm just not that paranoid. Though I do recognise that it is a threat to our democracy and way of life. depending on how things pan out over the next few years.
If we the public merely roll over and let it happen with a mere wimper of a protest. Then that would be a sign that the governmnet can continue to erode more of our liberties in the name of convinience for the civil service, anti terror, fraud, street security, etc....
However if we stand up and say no thats enough your not getting anymore.
then the governmnet would have to back down as they did with the poll tax and fuel escalator.
I'm all for protesting against ID cards but it won't work as a mass movement if the general public think that anti ID card people are just paranoid about the governmnet being out to get them. Which their not. Not this government anyway.
for more information about resisting ID cards see www.no2id.net
I have to say i am very concerned about the way things are going and if you think about freedom of speech and all that as things are now we can not say certain things we all have to be diplomatic? id cards will not make us any safer it just lets the goverment and who ever else know everything about us, i find it very scary. I wish i had faith but i dont england has gone to the dogs its on a very slippery slope downhill to a very dark place and dont think you will have a choice in id cards eye scanning fingerprinting etc,were not the criminals but this will happen it already is. Is this the start of new world order i wonder but thinking about it our goverment can hardly order there lunch so i guess its not new world order? but on a serious note do they really think we could trust them with all our personel stuff when almost everything they do is a mess
Just as an aside on the fingerprinting issue, I suspect all of this will eventually be said to aid war on terror - but we need to realise - these terrorists aren't stupid - they get round things like this - look at Abu Hamza - no way they could check his fingerprints!!!
The point is not really about having nothing to hide its about being told you will do this, i have nothing to hide but who do the goverment think they are we pay there wages and they dictate to us what is what,do you really think this will make us safer? i really dont think so and safer from who or what was it not our goverment who caused this problem,i am worried there are cameras everywhere why? protection for us from what THEM i think the two things that rule this world is money and fear and they have both, mabey i sound a bit over the top but we all seem to be innocently walking into a web of deception and lies i proberly would not be so over the top if it was just about our goverment cous there plonkers its the other country our goverment kiss bottoms with we have to watch them they are a big worry
thanks riccardo did check out the link made good reading but did confirm my views, it was nice to see im not the only loon out there who is not being taken in by this
lol yeah no problem strawberries. I sometimes think I'm being a bit paranoid then another blow to our civil liberies come in from our governmnet.
Today it was the portable fingerprint scanner that is being tested by a police force (can't remember which one), the same thing i think as mentioned by Black Cloud.
What worries me is when all these things get linked up. According to the governmnet they will have all our fingerprints on the National Identity Register along with all the other bits of info they want to put on to it, about us. So it doesn't take a wild leap of imagination to see that the police using this handheld fingerprint scanner will say to the governmnet. Hey, this new portable fingerprint scanners great, but it would be even better if we had access to the NIR so we can check the fingerprints of the person we've stopped on the street against everyones fingerprints in the country.
With this system there is no need for an ID card, Your own fingerprint will be your ID card.
This wouldn't be so bad if it was just identifing you. but if the governmnet let the police have access to the NIR with all its information you can just see them start to profile people as troublemakers or awkward customers. And the innocent till proven guilty will just go out the window. I mean some of the police already seem to have scant disregaurd for this principle anyway, egged on by Tony Blair and his retoric, Just see Forest Gate for one example.
What really annoys me is that there are ways to introduce these technologies and methods without infringing on our liberties so much. But the governmnet just doesn't care about these things. And they can't be bothered spending the time looking in to the alternatives. They're too busy trying to grab those headlines.
dont really know if i should say this as i am paranoid and god knows who is reading but i remember from a past job that when this police scanner was being tested it had a lot of problems in identifing the wrong people, oh dear another mess at the cost of the tax payer, if it means i can not travel i dont care i will not have a id card as someone else said nothing to hide dont need to be identified,microchip the criminals of the country make it safe for our children? stop holding us accountable for the mess they made,terrisiom is a concern to me but not at the cost of my rights,mabey if they stopped sticking there nose in everywhere we could have all the life we dererve will check out new link in a mo thanks
oh yeah and while i remember if you have been robbed or in a accident anything when fingerprints are taken at scene i think all this data is kept already so later on if your fingerprint is taken for whatever reason like just driving as it seems they already know about you and this is now, im off to sand my fingerprints off its the only way?
sanding is no good mabey super glue? I talking to a friend of mine who is from new york about id cards, she said she herself dose not have a problem they have id cards already i was a bit lost for words and later when i mulled it over i realised they are far more gullable than us folk in britian i thought about the many lies there goverment has told them as far back as i can remember which started with the so called moon landing NOT?murders of presendents(is that spelt right,sorry my spelling is rubbish) area 51 which is not there according to there goverment(check out ikonos area 51 for satelite views)and last but not least dare i say it 911 check out petrodoller for that. Is this what we have comming mabey we will be as sucked in as our buddies across the altantic,im not sure but just makes you think? i dont think im paronoid.As for my very good friend i said nothing i didnt want to ruin THE AMERICAN DREAM?
I didn't see the programme but I assume it was about RFID, identity cards and CCTV.
Some people think that if we have nothing to hide we have nothing to fear. The Jews in Europe had nothing to hide in 1932. In 1933, when the Jew-hating maniac Nazis came to power in Germany, they did have something to hide. So did all opponents of the Nazis. If the Nazis had had the kind of electronic databases that exist now and the means to spy on people that exist now, they would have been able to round up every last one of the Jews instead of 'just' six million. No, the Jews had nothing to hide so would have had nothing to fear about new spying technology. We don't know what the future holds. We don't know what innocent activities of today will be frowned upon tomorrow.
I believe that some schools in the UK have fingerprint registration each morning. I haven't checked this out thoroughly but I have seen references to it.
shame you missed it if you want to check it out it is on again tonight can not remember time i think 7 or 8. I would be intreasted to read other peoples views?
