Originally posted by merlin wood: ...or is it just that science can't yet explain what it is that cna be thought significant about the univers that includes lif on Earth?
Sorry, when de-typoed, this should read: ...or is it just that science can't yet explain what it is that can be thought significant about the universe that includes life on Earth?
So while quantum theory can now account for a great deal about the chemical, nuclear and electromagnetic properties of matter in terms of the behaviour of its smallest or subatomic parts, it can't explain how any of this behaviour is possible and, in general, how matter in any form - from atomic hydrogen to human beings - can be or remain organised out of these parts and despite the action of all the forces.
And we can wonder whether it is because of this theoretical limitation that there are problems in explaining how the universe is in its large scale organised form, including stars, planetary systems, galaxies and galaxy clusters.
.. yes, Gravity. They cite newtons law of Gravity yet it is a theory. They measure the cause (apple dropping) and the effect (apple hits floor in a certain time) then come up with a constant factor which they term Gravity. As you can't measure Gravity (you only measure it's effects on things) how the hell can a Theory then be called a Law? The effects of Intergalactic Gravitional Waves travel 17 times faster than the speed of light yet "they" insist nothing travels faster than light. Theoretical Sub-atomic particles have been proposed yet never measured, just their effects, and the inclusion of the magic constant will eventually make the existence of said particles become a matter of fact.
Originally posted by Innocent Defendant: I keep reading the same 'MAGIC WORD' "THEORY" for crying out loud check what the word means before using it to PROVE or DISPROVE a point!
There are two major quaetions: Given just the known properties of the forces, how can matter in any form be and remain organised out of its subatomic parts?
How could you describe a cause acting in addition to the forces so that matter can remain subatomically organised or in any form at all?
For more details google foranewageofreason for a blogspirit blog.
Yes.......If humanity is so bloody clever, how is it that we're destroying the very basis for continuing our existence on the face of the planet? As science represents one of the pre-eminent intellectual elites, they must therefore share pre-eminent responsibility for the limitations of understanding that have lead us to the edge of this ecological abyss!.
Linz, I think you have to define or explain exactly what you mean by `nothing`. Do you simply mean the universe, or would you include abstract entities like, for instance, the prime numbers as well?
Of course, so far you`ve all missed the hardest question of all. Namely, experiential consciousness (sometimes referred to as `qualia`). Scientists can at least give an outline description of how the universe started and evolved, how life evolved, but simply have no idea why, for instance, when red light strikes your retina, you have the sensation of redness. No scientist could begin to say how you could determine whether the sensation your friend experiences when she or he receives red light is the same as the sensation you experience, and not, for instance, the sensation you experience when green light strikes your retina.
There are amazing things going on now in cosmology and in subatomic physics; from the biggest to the smallest, so to speak.
It is helpful to think in terms of things that at one time had to be explained by supernatural means because the natural (scientific) understanding of the universe was just not advanced enough. (eclipses, weather, disease, etc.) Then, as science progressed and explained these phenomena, there were always a few questions left to supernature. In modern times we often turn to religion for explanations of things that science may someday explain.
Of course science will not likely ever explain everything. But as quantum science brings us closer to describing the details of the existence of matter, and cosmology has to create new hypotheses, such as those pertaining to "dark matter" and "dark energy", to explain the observable universe, it is likely that eventually religion and science will find themselves to be closely linked, not opposite ends of a spectrum.
Yes, learn the scientific meaning of theory. It makes a world of difference. But despite the way that the world seems to be falling around our ears politically and socially in the world order, there has never been a more exciting time for science. The BIG question. A theory of EVERYTHING.
What properties of the brain make conscious thought possible, what is experience? Once it is understood, what will the limitations of it be? Are we beings of matter destined to live as small, unconnected pockets of subjective experience or will it be possible to merge all the universes matter into one giant thinking machine?
On a similar note - what is the endgame of the universe? Will intelligence play a part in prolonging the existence of the universe when it should have otherwise perished?
Consciousness is one of the big ones. Some scientists cross it off right away by saying that it is not possible for a complex system to understand itself. But I just don't know.
The end of this particular 3 (or 11 or more) dimensional universe should be knowable one day, after we've sorted out all of the dark matter and dark energy, and whether the speed of light really is a constant. May not know tomorrow, but I think we'll be able to get that one eventually.
I agree with you Elfuente. Consciousness is the big one period, not one of the big ones of many or at least a few...
Why are still so preoccupied with the discovery of dimensional matter is beyond me since causality has no dimension and we know and understand this. Surely our focus must now shift not away from matter but onto the next logical step in which we start to share conscious experience in order to have scientific data that can be analysed is an objective way and thus properly marry the two together as they seem to inextricably be.
I think we're heading in the direction that you describe. The last twenty years or so of cutting edge physics has been about learning that we don't know as much as we thought we did (hence dark energy and dark matter, still not understood at all) and about some of the more fundamental principles of nature. We still don't know what causes gravity. There are hypotheses about particles called gravitons that are somehow free from many laws of physics (like the light-speed constant and E=mc^2) and yet we deal with its effects every minute of our lives. And every time we build a bigger machine for studying subatomic particles we learn that there are more and smaller ones that we didn't know about. The Higgs boson, for example, sometimes referred to as the "God particle", has never been observed. It is postulated by much intricate math and theoretical physics, and it is absolutely necessary to make much of the math of modern physics work, but it's never been seen. Maybe one of the new machines, like the Large Hadron Collider at CERN, will shed some light.
The fine details of dimensional space are very important, especially for understanding the bounty of new technology that quantum physics will hopefully bring, seemingly just around the corner. It will be another tricky time for mankind, because whoever discovers the Higgs boson or builds the first reliable quantum computer will surely rule the world, at least for a while.
Politics and social expectations always get in the way of science and big scientific projects. There are still people with superstitious worries about taking shots, including life-saving (usually) flu vaccines. Now there's the big deal about the vaccine for human pappiloma virus (HPV) and making it a requirement for young girls to attend school. It's way too soon for that, but the politicians want an opportunity to show off their power over nature, while with the other hand they are making agreements that will continue the production of greenhouse gasses at higher and higher rates. A good rule of thumb is, If the government is involved, there's probably something about it that's not right. We have to educate ourselves and act on that education. Whether we do that or not will determine whether there will be permanent second-class citizens in our future.
Hmmm, yes I agree with much of what you suggest and I too welcome the Large Hadron Collider. The experiments and learning that will come from this machine are very exciting indeed but I wish to again express my concern that IMO there is still too much preoccupation with dimensional matter alone and more specifically the indoctrinated dimensional mindset and state of conscience that any blinkered endeavour breeds.
I do not doubt that we will discover some extremely interesting phenomena from this machine but history also in a very scientifically implicit way shows me that it will also create many more questions…and round and round we are bound to go until we change our outlook…???
The later part of your post accurately describes the delusional reality that humanity is making for itself today and drowning within where we now fight for control over each other as commodities and for ourselves as separate agents of control over the very same dimension that actually defines us - not the other way around as we would overwhelmingly accept it.
Whether the model of physics we employ in life is right or wrong is unimportant because we live accordingly. We crave and want to believe in definite and dimensional terms because we think it gives us answers and guidance despite the reality that all the answers would in fact robs us of any chance of experiencing true liberty and freedom.
The advance of scientific probing though noble to begin with has lost its way where we now find ourselves infatuated with dimensional control instead of real scientific discovery. We are ever increasingly becoming lost within a web of self delusion because we indoctrinate our minds by bolstering the cosmetic dimensional science of form above and beyond the facts.
The facts are that there simply are no pervasive facts about the world of form unlike the fact that there is an all pervasive and ever present tool to learning about reality through the phenomena of the inherently dimensionless mind inextricably linked within a dimensional world…
Governments peddle delusions and lies not because they inherrantly want to or because they do not try but because they too are delusional. It is conscious endeavours that lead to any state of conscience being formed and defining that beings take on reality. Whether that conscience is individual or shared, acceptable or hostile or agreeable cannot be attributable to any dimensional factors of form since the dimensional world of form is the same for all of us…so who is right and who is wrong...
Does it matter that we do not know all there is to know about form…can we…??? Surely this is an impossible realm of demigods and alchemists not human beings. We would not be able to create matter from no-matter but surely we would be able to live the fairy tails and turn toads into our prince / princess charming through chemical manipulation but would they have a mind to love us with…???
